1994 GA SE Quad 4 Starting Problems

[deano777]

I have searched through the threads and have not found a similar problem, so here is mine.

I have a 1994 SE with a Quad 4 2.3. The car will never start on the first try. I turn the key and hear the fuel pump for about 2 seconds. When it turns over is doesn't sound like there is compresson. The car turns over and just doesn't catch. Afer one or two tries, it fires right up. I have no problems driving after it starts. The car is garaged, so it isn't cold (like it gets cold in Sacramento).

I replaced the coil packs about 6 months ago. The serpentine tensioner last month. Have not checked the plugs or injectors. I think I replaced the fuel filter within the last 6 months. I also just changed the oil/filter/air filter with no change.

Any ideas?

Thanks.

[ironray75]

Well I would say check the spark plugs.

[deano777]

Ok, so I replaced the plugs tonight and same thing. Won't start on the first try. I also threw in a Chevron Fuel System cleaner just for kicks...

None of the Idiot lights are on; I have seen other people talk about getting the codes from the computer, is there a way to see them if the "Check Engine" light isn't on?

[4kQuad]

Quads will turn over 3 to 7 times before they start. The censor that censes where the crank is has to go by #1 plug to find it, the next time buy it sends spark and it will fire up.

So if you turn the key and the car turns 6 or 10 times with out starting. Then if you turn the key again it starts, my idea is out the door, but if it just turns over MORE than other cars, it is some what normal for quads.

[dcmain]

Originally posted by deano777

None of the Idiot lights are on; I have seen other people talk about getting the codes from the computer, is there a way to see them if the "Check Engine" light isn't on?

Look at this pic:

The connector for looking at the codes is below the instrument panel and has a rectangular shape. In the upper right hand corner of the connector are Pins A and B. Take a paper clip (while the car is off) and short those two together. This gives ground to the diagnostic circuit in the computer. Leave the clip in and turn the key slowly to the run position. Don't go all the way to the start(engine cranking). You should see the idiot lights all come on and the check engine light will start to blink out codes slowly. The first code should be 12. This indicates the diagnostics are working properly. It will give you 12 (one blink, pause, two blinks, longer pause) three times. Any codes it gives after these will be for problems found within the last 100 start cycles. They will all be repeated three times. The circuit will finish by repeating the 12 code. If there are no codes stored, you will just get 12 continuously. Don't forget to remove the paper clip after turning off the ignition.

Let me know the codes, if you find any, and I can give you the troubleshooting info. I have the 92 GA SE which is run by the same ECU and the shop manuals are very good for this sort of thing.

Another alternative is to go to an autozone or other auto supply store that advertises free diagnostics, and have them pull the codes for you

[deano777]

Originally posted by 4kQuad
Quads will turn over 3 to 7 times before they start. The censor that censes where the crank is has to go by #1 plug to find it, the next time buy it sends spark and it will fire up.


It cranks, but I need to rotate the key back and then try again.

I did notice that when I do just let it crank, the speedometer floats to about 20mph.

Thanks dcmain, I will try to get the codes tonight and see what's in there!

When I got to work this morning, I shut the engine off and then restarted to see if it would go the first time and it did. But I went and got gas, after 10 minutes I had to try several times.

When I move the key forward and hear the fuel pump start and then stop, does it stop because of a timer or that adequate fuel pressure is in the fuel rail?

Man this is frustraing...

[Brad97GS]

Yes, the fuel pump will only run for a couple of seconds if you turn the key to On. That's normal. :)

This sounds similar to what someone I used to work with went through last year. Supposedly her dad replaced the starter, which fixed it, but that always confused me because it seemed to crank okay. Though maybe the original starter was missing some teeth...

[deano777]

The only reason I ruled out the starter is because I had my wife try to start it while I watched the engine. All the belts turned when she turned it over. I should get under there and check the teeth just to be sure though...

[LargeFish]

I don't think the paper clip trick will work on your '94 as I'm pretty sure they changed the diagnostic port that year. But if you get it to work, by all means let us know. I'm pretty sure you have to take it somewhere to get it read.

[Brad97GS]

Good point. Yeah, '94s won't let you get the trouble codes with the paperclip method. :(

[deano777]

No dice on the paperclip trick. The connection port is a 12 port female. It looks like there are only 3 contact points in it too. Oh well.

I am going to pull the throttle body and give it a good cleaning. I'll post my results after that. I think I'll have to break down and send it to my mechanic... :mad:

[deano777]

This afternoon I had my wife turn the ignition while I watched the engine. The starter engaged and the belts turned, then the starter raced like it didn't have a load and the belts stopped. Looks like the starter was disengaging and the starter motor was still turning. Probably a bad Solenoid.

I replaced the starter unit and now it works fine. Removing it was a total bear. I had to pull out the fan, but before that, you have to detach one of the dog-bone mounts so you can "rock" the engine back. Then I had to pull the Throttle Body so I could actually turn the socket on the front bolt of the starter. Oh yeah, and I had to remove the oil filter to get the starter out...

Thanks for all the help! :horay: