Why was the M62 Supercharger discontinued?

[MantaGreen97]

Just out of general curiousity, I was wondering, why did Eaton/Magnuson discontinue the M62 supercharger? (The one for the 3400). I did a search and see there were only like 14 of the "gen 4" ones made.

Why'd they put all the R&D into it and then make only a few of them and then discontinue it altogether???

I searched but didn't see anyone explain why they dropped it...

[sunrunner_pei]

Lack of sales, mostly. :(

[JoeyK]

I kinda remember reading somewhere that the torque produced with those would make a short lifespan for your transmission & that scared alot of people away from the idea. I could be wrong but like I said, I THINK I remember reading that somewhere.

[ChevelleSSLS6]

well, add a tranny cooler. People are so stupid.

Why do you think there's so many japanese cars on the road these days? (and I'm not speaking of the sports cars, I'm saying plainjane disposable crap)

as I said, people are stupid. Does anyone understand why American companies are going down and out?

EDIT: GM should have made a heavier duty transmission. Their RWD stuff is very good but from what I've been hearing FWD trannies are weak.:???:

[JoeyK]

I don't know what you mean by "People are stupid" but I doubt a transmision cooler is going to help with the intearnals disintegrating from too much torque. I suppose it'd help out if there is a heat issue.
before you start ragging on American cars you must realize in the case of the GA you are dealing with 1990's technology. Most newer GM cars are built to take more but not so in this case. The GA has outlived it's calling, it is old technology. That's why it's going bye-bye.

[MantaGreen97]

Originally posted by JoeyK
before you start ragging on American cars you must realize in the case of the GA you are dealing with 1990's technology. Most newer GM cars are built to take more but not so in this case. The GA has outlived it's calling, it is old technology. That's why it's going bye-bye.

I dunno it isn't necessarily an "out-of-date" issue. The 96 and 97 (and probably 94 and 95) Grand Ams with the 3100 have the 4T60-E transmission in them. In 98 they switched over to the 4T40-E and 4T45-E (the latter was on 99+ GAGTs) transmissions. Both handle less torque than the 4T60-E which was (in one form or another) always used on cars with the 3800.

The truth is GM designed a lower-cost transmission for 98 and later cars using either the 3100 or 3400 engines, because [stock] they didn't need a transmission able to handle as much torque as the 3800 did.

[JoeyK]

Out of date meaning it was designed for the trends of the 90's. People weren't souping up grocery getter fwd's then, ya know? That's why I said it.
The GA was designed for a specific target buyer, predominately women. I assume women that wanted a sporty alternative to the mini van & suv. Anyways, given the target buyer, I can see why they went with the drive train they did. Back then that was the way of thinking. Things have changed so much, not only in the designs of the newer generation of cars but also thier thinking in the target customers & markets also.
If you don't modify the engine for more hp & torque the transmission is just fine. (Don't get me wrong it'll handle more but not large amounts.) They just figured that women were thier targets for this car & you don't see any women modifying cars, or atleast back in '99 you didn't hear so much about it & you gotta remember - the design stages for this gen started way before '99.

But yes, sad to say the GA is, in all respect out of date. I just wish they would have continued the nameplate. I fully understand why they are ceasing production on this generation.

[gran_dam98]

Originally posted by MantaGreen97
I dunno it isn't necessarily an "out-of-date" issue. The 96 and 97 (and probably 94 and 95) Grand Ams with the 3100 have the 4T60-E transmission in them. In 98 they switched over to the 4T40-E and 4T45-E (the latter was on 99+ GAGTs) transmissions. Both handle less torque than the 4T60-E which was (in one form or another) always used on cars with the 3800.

The truth is GM designed a lower-cost transmission for 98 and later cars using either the 3100 or 3400 engines, because [stock] they didn't need a transmission able to handle as much torque as the 3800 did.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm almost positive the 4T40-E and 4T45-E, did not start until 99+ When I checked w/ my dealer, and they ran my VIN, they told me I had the 4T60-E

[MantaGreen97]

Originally posted by gran_dam98
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm almost positive the 4T40-E and 4T45-E, did not start until 99+ When I checked w/ my dealer, and they ran my VIN, they told me I had the 4T60-E

You could indeed have a 4T60-E I believe, depending on when your car was manufactured. However I do remember there used to be an official GM website that used to retain the running changes of each model line. The 1998 GA definitely did show "New 4T40-E Transmission" as a "feature" on those listings. I think cars manufactured in the later half of 98 (still 98 model year cars) got the 4T40-E, but you're right with 1998 GAs you'd have to check either the Transaxle ID tag or have it checked against your VIN, to be sure what it has.

[Ackbar00]

Id say lack of performance was the reason for it to go away.

[JoeyK]

Originally posted by Ackbar00
Id say lack of performance was the reason for it to go away.
If you're referring to the Grand Am; The Grand Am is not a "performance car". Never was said to be & was never designed to be. So that's a moot point.

[Matt95GT]

:troll: Let's not let this thread go this route... there's no reason to even debate about this. A 40% increase in base horsepower is something any performance enthusist can enjoy on their choice of vehicle.

[JoeyK]

I could sense it too & I agree, it doesn't need to go this route. That's why I stated the obvious & that's all I have to say about it.

[TA^Guy]

Originally posted by ChevelleSSLS6
well, add a tranny cooler. People are so stupid.
Wow your so inteligent aren't you?

Stupid is someone who thinks the stress from incressed torque can be fixed by adding a tranny cooler. :lol:

You should sell tranny coolers on Ebay and put ArtCarr, TCI and B&M out of bussiness.
:funny:
Originally posted by ChevelleSSLS6
Why do you think there's so many japanese cars on the road these days? (and I'm not speaking of the sports cars, I'm saying plainjane disposable crap)

as I said, people are stupid. Does anyone understand why American companies are going down and out?
What the hell are you babbling about? Totally off topic and out of left field.

[03gagt]

So the reason they went out was? Also if you contact them would they still do the SC or is everything dead?

[ChevelleSSLS6]

For the trolls:
Why do you think there's so many japanese cars on the road these days? (and I'm not speaking of the sports cars, I'm saying plainjane disposable crap)people can't think for themselves, they hear jap cars last forever so they buy a jap car.

as I said, people are stupid. Does anyone understand why American companies are going down and out?and people buying foregin crap is why the US economy is going kaput. People buy these disposable foregin cars and not American cars, put that together and you have more unemployment here.

who on earth thought I was bashing American cars? Wierd.:roll2:

Ok, no more troll food.

I was off subject and not only in left field, but sleeping there too.

Now, let's move on and grow up.

They likely stopped making them due to lack of demand. It's a shame Pontiac didn't offer a SC3400 as an option... a Grand Am GTP would have been sweet. Heat=increased wear=shorter service life... but the bottom line is the torque handling capacity of the driveline itself, I'm not that stupid to think a tranny cooler is a cure all for a tranny with weak internals

[Themeneea]

how are foregin cars crap? and whats a foregin disposable car?

[Ackbar00]

Originally posted by JoeyK
If you're referring to the Grand Am; The Grand Am is not a "performance car". Never was said to be & was never designed to be. So that's a moot point.


Did I say Grand Am ANYWHERE in my post? Nope. I said lack of performance gain for the buck. But thanks for the quote:cool:

[30thAnnGAGT]

Originally posted by 03gagt
So the reason they went out was? Also if you contact them would they still do the SC or is everything dead?

The real reason they did was eluded to earlier in this thread. 18 Total Kits were produced. GM owns 6 of them. 12 were sold on the public market and have changed hands a few times. The only way to get one is to find a used kit.

The reason they went out of production was that there were transmisison issues caused early on. I believe Pat and Keith were some of the first "victims" of this particular issue. Easton/Maguesson stopped producing the kits early on because of these issues.

GM used the 4T65-E which is a heavier duty front wheel drive trans on the Grand Am SC/T concepts because of early on issues with the 4T45-E with which our cars are equipped.

The 45 and 65 are not weak transmissions, but if you put a 40% increase in hp and torque numbers you're beginning to push the envelope.

[JoeyK]

Originally posted by Ackbar00
Did I say Grand Am ANYWHERE in my post? Nope. I said lack of performance gain for the buck. But thanks for the quote:cool:

So you were referring to the M62 SC?

... Kinda fruity putting poeple's quotes on your signature like that but oh well, whatever floats your boat. That statement you quoted couldn't be any more true.;)

[SCGA1]

Originally posted by 30thAnnGAGT
The real reason they did was eluded to earlier in this thread. 18 Total Kits were produced. GM owns 6 of them. 12 were sold on the public market and have changed hands a few times. The only way to get one is to find a used kit.

The reason they went out of production was that there were transmisison issues caused early on. I believe Pat and Keith were some of the first "victims" of this particular issue. Easton/Maguesson stopped producing the kits early on because of these issues.

GM used the 4T65-E which is a heavier duty front wheel drive trans on the Grand Am SC/T concepts because of early on issues with the 4T45-E with which our cars are equipped.

The 45 and 65 are not weak transmissions, but if you put a 40% increase in hp and torque numbers you're beginning to push the envelope. Yeah, my tranny went bye-bye alright. I'm doing good on this tranny with the cooler(2.5 years) and the 2.5" SC pulley.

[MantaGreen97]

Originally posted by 30thAnnGAGT
The real reason they did was eluded to earlier in this thread. 18 Total Kits were produced. GM owns 6 of them. 12 were sold on the public market and have changed hands a few times. The only way to get one is to find a used kit.

The reason they went out of production was that there were transmisison issues caused early on. I believe Pat and Keith were some of the first "victims" of this particular issue. Easton/Maguesson stopped producing the kits early on because of these issues.

GM used the 4T65-E which is a heavier duty front wheel drive trans on the Grand Am SC/T concepts because of early on issues with the 4T45-E with which our cars are equipped.


Well I haven't checked the forum in a few days but I'll say thank you at least. Ony a few of the posts on the thread actually addressed the original question, lol.

As for the transmissions, I knew the 4T65-E would have had to have been used but I thought that transmission would be good for the torque output since it handles the L67 in the GP. I know the original SC/T concept actually had more power than the L67-equipped GP GTPs but not by much.

I guess the real answer is two-fold... The consumer-level kits were discontinued since the 4T45-E trans would not hold up well if someone added the kit to their car with no transmission upgrade (something that would have been less likely if they never started the 4T4x series transmissions and kept the 4T60-E in the GA); secondly GM decided against a GA SC/T and therefore the M62 was no longer necessary for that application either.

Even with the 6th gen Grand Am (the G6) they decided to go with no S/C and with the 3900 instead, so definitely no reason to start producing the M62 again. Oh well it was certainly a nice product, though I guess a bit expensive.

[30thAnnGAGT]

^ summed up very well. The issue with the M62 would have been warranty issues. Well that and the price increase in the vehicle itself should the option have been released.

To recall and fix transmissions on the many cars would have been a grave mistake, and I'm not thinking too many people would have been in the market for a 30,000 dollar Grand Am, when the GTP Grand Prix was 32

[nightly99gt]

Is there any good places to build up a 99 GA tranny? And what about shift kits?

[JoeyK]

There's some shop on the 'net that sells a "garunteed bulletproof" Trans. but it costs around $3,500 if I remeber correctly. I gotta couple more years then I will be looking into getting one myself.

[Bjornboy81]

^ try a search first. If you cant' find anything, then ask this question in another thread please. No one is going to find your question buried in this thread about a supercharger :)

[Bjornboy81]

Originally posted by JoeyK
There's some shop on the 'net that sells a "garunteed bulletproof" Trans. but it costs around $3,500 if I remeber correctly. I gotta couple more years then I will be looking into getting one myself. :lol: I stand corrected...someone did find it :D

[JoeyK]

:lol: Good point though.:lol:

[JoeyK]

I think I saved the url somewhere. If/ when I find it I will post it.:)

[nightly99gt]

Just so im clear, im new to this Grand Am thing, just recently purchased mine.

Our cars have the 4T45-E? Will a 4T65-E drop in? Because I found this......

http://importperformancetransmission.com/gmautofwd.shtml

[MantaGreen97]

Originally posted by nightly99gt
Just so im clear, im new to this Grand Am thing, just recently purchased mine.

Our cars have the 4T45-E? Will a 4T65-E drop in? Because I found this......

http://importperformancetransmission.com/gmautofwd.shtml

It all depends on your year.

95 and 96-98 GAs with the 3100 will have the 4T60-E; though 98s can also have the 4T40-E.

99+ GAs with the 3400 should be as follows:
SE 4T40-E
GT 4T45-E
(Though it may depend on your year and what they actually put in, so check your transmission via the nameplate or from the VIN. But it will be either of the 40-series).

The 4T60-E or 4T65-E should fit into a 99+ GA but don't quote me on that 'cause I'm not 100% sure. I know the 3100 and 3400 are compatible with any of the 4T60/65-E or 4T40/45-E but I'm not sure about the car-transmission compatibility.

[ChevelleSSLS6]

Originally posted by SCGA1
Yeah, my tranny went bye-bye alright. I'm doing good on this tranny with the cooler(2.5 years) and the 2.5" SC pulley.

wan't it me who suggested adding a tranny cooler to help prolong tranny life earlier in this thread and soon thereafter indirectly called stupid?

hmmm...

but anyways, too bad the trannies don't have the torque capacity to handle them, it would have been awesome.

[92CamaroRS]

Originally posted by ChevelleSSLS6
wan't it me who suggested adding a tranny cooler to help prolong tranny life earlier in this thread and soon thereafter indirectly called stupid?

hmmm...

but anyways, too bad the trannies don't have the torque capacity to handle them, it would have been awesome.

I'm pretty sure Keith did a bit more than just added a tranny cooler.

[SCGA1]

Originally posted by 92CamaroRS
I'm pretty sure Keith did a bit more than just added a tranny cooler. Actually, all that I did to the tranny was add the cooler. I have an ASE Performance Chip that was in the PCM for about 3.5 years.:)