Squeal coming from the alternator-area

[DontPassTheFence]

Yes, I have a loud squeal coming from the area around the alternator, its hard to pin-point but its definitely coming from the passenger-front/muiddle section of the engine, right where all my pulley-driven buddies reside. I have checked the belt, and its pretty good, only 10K miles on it, no cracks, etc, I cant get to the belt tensioner easily, so I dont know if the belt needs to be tightened or loosened. However; one interesting point here, it only squeals during periods of low temperatures, always on cold start up, but once the engine bay heats up completely (20 minutes of driving in sub-50 degree temperatures) its fine. During the days (60-70 degrees) it doesnt squeal at all.

Also, the squealing does not increase in tempo/pitch/volume as the engine revs higher. I can hear it most noticably when downshifting, and decelerating and also accelerating slowly. After about 3K rpms, the engine drowns out most of the noise, and by about 4500rpms you cant even hear it, so I imagine that it doesnt get louder or more prominent when the engine revs higher. This is quite a perdicament, also, the car temp is normal, the oil and coolant levels are normal, tire PSI is at 35 all around, no noticable change in gas mileage, the intake air temperature is around 60-70 degrees at night and about 80 degrees during the day. Battery output is still a constant 12.8-12.5 when the accessories are on but the engine is not, and a solid 14.1-13.8 when the car is idling. I have checked everything possible, the car runs the exact same and has throw no codes, so can ya help me out on this one, Im stumped. I mayhave given too much information in this thread, but I figured its best if you guys know everything about the car, just in case. let me know what ya think.
Thanks alot for any help/information that can be provided :D

[Mike94SE]

My dad once used candle wax ro silence a Grand Marquis a friend of his had.

[4kQuad]

Your belt is loose, that is the squeel.

A belt should have about 1 inch of play. Grab the belt, pull up as far as you can. Now push down as far as you can. I bet it moves like 2 or more. It should only be 1 inch. ( about )

The squeel stops after a while because the belt slips till it gets warm enough to stick. It rubber.

Once the car is shut off and the belt is allowed to cool, it squeels again. The heating up effect is also why it stops after 20 minutes or so.

Replace the belt, not just tighten it. Ok you can just tighten it but as many times as it has gotten hot and what not, there is no way to know what shape the rubber in the belt is in. So I suggest buying a new one.

[tenspeed]

This is going to sound strange but try squirting some WD40 on the belt face as it'srunning. If the noise goes away, it's your belt.

[DontPassTheFence]

Ok, Ill do the wd40 -- but replacing that belt is going to be a BITCH! the tensioner is a fun place to get to (I hope I can go through the fenderwell) also; the gatorback belts are pretty $$$ -- but thanks , its cheaper than an alternatior or anythign else

[cocobob]

Check the color of the insulation blanket under the hood just above the alternator. If its collected particles giving a stain then maybe its the bushing of the alternator that`s beginning to fail. I have had to change my alternator twice on my 97`. Seems like the alternator on these GA`s do not last long. If the belt is not worn & has the proper tension tolerance as per the manual (i.e. @one inch of finger pressure movement) its probably time to buy a new alternator. When buying one get an aftermarket one that has 2 yr warranty instead of one year.
Cheers

[92CamaroRS]

If the belt iteslf is lose, most likely the tensionor needs replacing, there is nor tightening it, its an automatic tension system.

[Matt95GT]

My first alternator had bearings that would squeal.

I'd suggest doing your troubleshooting with the belt removed. Start the car with no belt (don't worry, only the AC and alternator are belt driven on the 2.4) briefly. If there's no noise, you have isolated the sound to the belt/tensioner/alternator/AC compressor. Spin each accessory with your hand... there shouldn't be any sound at all. There should be no wobble to the alternator pulley. (Mine wobbled, which explained the noise and my mystery shredded belts). If you still haven't found anything it's likely the belt and/or tensioner.

BTW, I have a used 2.4 tensioner from a 2001 that I never needed for my 2.4 SC install, if you need one.

Originally posted by DontPassTheFence
but replacing that belt is going to be a BITCH! the tensioner is a fun place to get to (I hope I can go through the fenderwell)

Meh. Cakewalk. Mine is a 2 person job to get the belt on now. :doh:
2.4 tensioner > 2.3 tensioner
Any stock 2.3/2.4 belt setup > my rediculous setup

I don't think there's any way to get to it through the fender. Use a 1/2" open-end wrench (as long as you can get). I highly recommend mechanics gloves and/or long pipe to put on end of wrench.

[DontPassTheFence]

ahh, I see - I have just learned like 10 things :lol:

Thanks alot for the tips Matt, looks like Ive got a fun weekend coming up, and Im sure my friend has a 1/2'' open-end wrench, but its gonna be small, so that should be fun. I hope he has some length of strong piping laying around. Also, I was thinking about taking off the belt since nothing important is run off of it but the alternator (this is the one time Ill praise the waterpump being driven off the timing chain, and being lodged inside the timing chain cover)

Just wish me luck so I dont hurt myself. :D
THe last time I changed a belt (the serp. belt on my 89 retta's 2.8L) I smacked my knuckles and broke a socket (it was a good day!) :lol:

[Matt95GT]

Originally posted by DontPassTheFence
THe last time I changed a belt (the serp. belt on my 89 retta's 2.8L) I smacked my knuckles and broke a socket (it was a good day!) :lol:

Mechanics gloves. Seriously... well worth the investment. You'll spend the same amount of cash of soap/Gojo and bandaids anyway.

[DontPassTheFence]

Youve got a point there... I think its time for a trip to the RicerZone. And I use soap + orange somethingsomething. So much soap.

[tenspeed]

I used a short combination wrench last time I changed the belt on the 2.4L.

Get a three foot piece of wire or rope and tie it to the boxed end of the wrench. Put the open end on the wrench on the bolt in the center of the tensioner roller. Loop the wire through the motor mount. Push the top of the wrench to the rear of the car and tie it off at the mount.

That will keep the tension off as you get the belt off and the new one on. I also used a long thin stick to get the belt around the bottom pully.

I think the stock belt was $18-$20 and the Gaterback was around $25.

[DontPassTheFence]

oh - well I guess I was looking at the wrong parts, or am blind when I was searching for serp. belts ... something said $189 ... But im glad that I was sorely mistaken. Again, thanks for all the help

[Matt95GT]

Originally posted by tenspeed
Get a three foot piece of wire or rope and tie it to the boxed end of the wrench. Put the open end on the wrench on the bolt in the center of the tensioner roller. Loop the wire through the motor mount. Push the top of the wrench to the rear of the car and tie it off at the mount.

That will keep the tension off as you get the belt off and the new one on. I also used a long thin stick to get the belt around the bottom pully.


I usually do that too, but for troubleshooting this issue (running the car without belt, spinning the tensioner by hand) I'd pass.

[DontPassTheFence]

someinteresting points of news here. First, the car doesnt make that squealing noise when on an incline (i park my car in my driveway,a nd the driveway slopes up. Next, I tried the wd40 method, and first I sprayed some all over the belt near the tensioner, and the squealing didnt stop or calm at all; next I tried spraying wd40 all over the belt at the alternator(covering the alt. in wd40) and the squealing piped down a lot, but then it turned into a whine that sounded like the belt was slipping on the pulleys (it was lubricated! so that makes sense) One more thing to add, upon pushing the belt with my finger it would only budge less than an inch, I actually measured it with my tape measure - about 7/8ths of an inch down, and when i tugged up on it with the my finger hooked underneathe it, it would move even less, about 3/4ths of an inch, so ID say the tension is fine... I I guess Im left with the alternator, the a/c compressor, and possibly the actual tensioner... Any further ideas guys? (I know I ask a lot of out ya) FYI - air temp tonight was about 39 degrees, winds of 7mph, humidity of 20%, all fluids in the car were normal, all temps normal or under, so nothing has changed. The battery stil reads healthy, and there are no weird sounds on cold start up. Id say this is a pretty insignificant problem right now, and since it doesnt seem severe at all, Ill definitely wait until the weekend to go at it with Matt's idea for troubleshooting. (ill probably buy a new belt for the hell of it, since I might as well change it while Im down there taking it off)

and on an unrelated note, how do I go about jacking my car up (or driving it up my ramps) to change the oil on it, nothing I have can fit under a lowered car :( (except that stupid-assed spare tire jack)

[tenspeed]

Originally posted by DontPassTheFence

and on an unrelated note, how do I go about jacking my car up (or driving it up my ramps) to change the oil on it, nothing I have can fit under a lowered car :( (except that stupid-assed spare tire jack)

When I used truck ramps with my car, I had pieces of 2x8 that I drove up on first then onto the ramp

[Matt95GT]

Originally posted by tenspeed
When I used truck ramps with my car, I had pieces of 2x8 that I drove up on first then onto the ramp

That works, or the wonderful multi-step "jack from the side first" and play music jack stands and jack the front technique.

[carlover626]

I use 2x4's in front of truck ramps to change my oil.

[DontPassTheFence]

yea i used the 2x4 up to the ramps, however, that was BEFORE my car was lowered :lol: - my car cant clear a 2 by 8, so Ill have to hope that i can get enough wood to have 4inches high - then ahve that go to a 2x8, then have the ramps. I hope that works

[tenspeed]

Maybe digging a pit would be easier....

[Mike_and_Gina]

I am curious if the noise you are hearing becomes worse when turning the steering wheel? I have the same situation happening with my car but it sounds to me like it is coming from just below the power steering resevoir...

(which I coincedentally had to refill with fluid as it was low, only to find out that there was a leaking "power steering seal" somewhere near the transmission that had to be replaced as well as a right axle seal near the transmission that was leaking)

[Matt95GT]

Originally posted by Mike_and_Gina
I am curious if the noise you are hearing becomes worse when turning the steering wheel? I have the same situation happening with my car but it sounds to me like it is coming from just below the power steering resevoir...

(which I coincedentally had to refill with fluid as it was low, only to find out that there was a leaking "power steering seal" somewhere near the transmission that had to be replaced as well as a right axle seal near the transmission that was leaking)

Doubtful it's the same noise. All powersteering components are on the drivers side of the car on 2.3/2.4 engines, not coupled to the main serpentine belt at all. (cam driven PS pump)

[DontPassTheFence]

Yep, its the same whether I turn or not. Actually, the damn suspension components make more noise than anything when turn to fulllock. Everything in there is old, beaten, rusted, and nearly destroyed. :(