John95GA
04-16-2003, 12:21 AM
(I apologize in advance if any of you have read this on other boards already, but I want to get as much input as possible...)
Some of you may know that I bought those heads and Lower Intake Manifold (LIM) from Alex (Mr98Pontiac) recently (from a 2000 Malibu--newer-generation 3100). Here is what I have and what I planned to have done...
Okay, here's what I have, performance-wise...
'95 Pontiac Grand Am, 3100 SFI V-6 (78K miles), no MAF
Performance mods: conical air filter w/ homemade heatshield, custom cat-back exhaust w/ 2.25" mandrel-bent piping and straight-through muffler, custom Superchips reprogram (done 3 years ago on-site at Superchips' headquarters; they verified that my computer was OBD-II).
My plan:
I plan on getting a full P&P w/ 3 or 5-angle valve job, and also P&P the LIM as much as possible. I will also buy a ported and port-matched UIM and 60-62mm TB from APOC or RSM, plus S&S headers (whenever they come out; 'thinking about trying the 3400 ones they already have developed). The only visible issue I see right now is the EGR--might have to make an adapter plate for that, I assume. My goal is to get consistent 14.x-second 1320 times w/ these mods (I'm probably around mid-high 15s now)....
Well, today I went to this machine shop my performance shop mechanic recommended to show the owner the heads and L.I.M. First, let me say I didn't get a good vibe from the guy. He sounded arrogant and got frustrated w/ me for asking many questions and not always following the points he was trying to prove, even though I never argued!?... He seemed to have a pretty nice shop though w/ flow bench and even Extrude Hone machines. 'Saw a lot of nicely done V-8 heads...
Anyway, his suggestion was to just clean the runners (they have a lot of EGR residue in them, apparently), work the bowl and do a valve job (3-5 angle or true curve, whichever he could achieve, depending on the room, etc.) and just port-match the plenum for the UIM to the TB I'll get. He said that the bowl/valve job would increase flow by 15-18% but that porting the runners of the heads really wouldn't make a difference (unless I had a more radical cam or something to that extent) and didn't recommend it. Anyone agree/disagree? He wants $600 for this small job, which seems kinda high to me. He said he'll port the runners and other crazy stuff (for more $$$) if I want him to, but doesn't want me coming back and complaining that it didn't live up to expectations, yadayada. I had to tell him many times that I'm not looking to build a 12-second car (which didn't seem to register w/ him for a while), just knock off 1 second on my 1/4 mile times. He believes it's possible if I do all the other stuff (bigger intakes, TB, and headers) also, but not to expect more than that. I'm not necessarily disagreeing w/ him, but I gotta wonder if it's even worth spending this much money to just have that small bit of work done to the heads...
Sorry for being long-winded; LOL! Opinions/suggestions, anyone?
Some of you may know that I bought those heads and Lower Intake Manifold (LIM) from Alex (Mr98Pontiac) recently (from a 2000 Malibu--newer-generation 3100). Here is what I have and what I planned to have done...
Okay, here's what I have, performance-wise...
'95 Pontiac Grand Am, 3100 SFI V-6 (78K miles), no MAF
Performance mods: conical air filter w/ homemade heatshield, custom cat-back exhaust w/ 2.25" mandrel-bent piping and straight-through muffler, custom Superchips reprogram (done 3 years ago on-site at Superchips' headquarters; they verified that my computer was OBD-II).
My plan:
I plan on getting a full P&P w/ 3 or 5-angle valve job, and also P&P the LIM as much as possible. I will also buy a ported and port-matched UIM and 60-62mm TB from APOC or RSM, plus S&S headers (whenever they come out; 'thinking about trying the 3400 ones they already have developed). The only visible issue I see right now is the EGR--might have to make an adapter plate for that, I assume. My goal is to get consistent 14.x-second 1320 times w/ these mods (I'm probably around mid-high 15s now)....
Well, today I went to this machine shop my performance shop mechanic recommended to show the owner the heads and L.I.M. First, let me say I didn't get a good vibe from the guy. He sounded arrogant and got frustrated w/ me for asking many questions and not always following the points he was trying to prove, even though I never argued!?... He seemed to have a pretty nice shop though w/ flow bench and even Extrude Hone machines. 'Saw a lot of nicely done V-8 heads...
Anyway, his suggestion was to just clean the runners (they have a lot of EGR residue in them, apparently), work the bowl and do a valve job (3-5 angle or true curve, whichever he could achieve, depending on the room, etc.) and just port-match the plenum for the UIM to the TB I'll get. He said that the bowl/valve job would increase flow by 15-18% but that porting the runners of the heads really wouldn't make a difference (unless I had a more radical cam or something to that extent) and didn't recommend it. Anyone agree/disagree? He wants $600 for this small job, which seems kinda high to me. He said he'll port the runners and other crazy stuff (for more $$$) if I want him to, but doesn't want me coming back and complaining that it didn't live up to expectations, yadayada. I had to tell him many times that I'm not looking to build a 12-second car (which didn't seem to register w/ him for a while), just knock off 1 second on my 1/4 mile times. He believes it's possible if I do all the other stuff (bigger intakes, TB, and headers) also, but not to expect more than that. I'm not necessarily disagreeing w/ him, but I gotta wonder if it's even worth spending this much money to just have that small bit of work done to the heads...
Sorry for being long-winded; LOL! Opinions/suggestions, anyone?