1995 Grand Am Stockcar - Go Fast & Turn Left

[97-4doorGT]

After hours of wrenching, welding and cussing the Grand Am is finally ready to make it's debut at the local track.

The engine is pretty much stock (as per the division rules). The stock gas tank has been removed and I've installed a fuel cell and in-line pump in the trunk. The exhaust has been opened up from the manifold back to 2.5"....no cat or muffler...just a noise-belching straight pipe.

The suspension is mostly stock (division rules). I've just added a 91 z-24 front strut tower bar and preloaded the swaybar links. The right front is cambered. Can't tell ya anything else.

I just got the lexan windshield cut out and I'll install it tomorrow morning. The only other remaining things to do are to hook up the fan switch and relocate the battery to the driver's compartment.

The division rules limit us to a 3.1l engine size and auto transmissions only. The whole darn car is supposed to be stock, but it's only cheating if you get caught. Mine is completely stock...honest.

I've got a list of other things I'd like to do to the car, but I'm taking it to the track tomorrow to see how she handles in a left turn.

I'm done this before....but I've raced Berettas. 90% of the people at this track run Berettas....I wanted something different. This will be the first Grand Am to ever run at this track (and the first 3100 sfi)

Ready or not, I'm taking this b*tch to the track tomorrow night. I'll have the best looking car there for at least a lap or two. I'll have to post pics of how the sheetmetal fairs out after it's first night at the track.

[97-4doorGT]

another pic of the car...

[97-4doorGT]

another pic....

[97-4doorGT]

This is the last pic....hopefully the competition will be seeing a lot of this end of the car.

[FusionDreams]

I love the NO SPONSOR on the side...haha. Good luck to you at the track, keep it off the wall.

[ManktheTank19]

Good luck :)

[97-4doorGT]

I'll post back to let you all know how the car performs. The season is almost over and we've got another baby on the way....so this is just a trial run for next year's season.

I think I can keep the car off the wall....it's going to harder to keep the a-holes out of my quarter panel.

The sad part is I've driven cars that looked worse than this one for a daily driver. This was a running, driving, 23mpg car before I stripped it down....hell the A/C was even working when I tore it down.

[03grandam]

GA FTW.Good luck man.

[TA^Guy]

Awesome! Good luck man, we're all cheering for you!

[97-4doorGT]

Took the car to the track last night. I got there late and didn't get to practice at all....the first lap around the track was my qualifying lap. Anyhow I qualified slow, but that put me in the 3rd heat race. I won the heat race.

In the B-main feature I started 7th and finished 4th. Those boys play rough.

The car handles well, but I've got to find a way to force a 1st gear downshift. It's a short track that requires a very deep second gear or a real tall first gear. I'm carrying too much speed through the curves for the computer to allow a first gear downshift. But when I come out of the curves I'm only at 3000rpm in second gear...only at 3900rpm when I get to the next curve. I NEED TO GET THE RPM'S UP.



Anyhow, here's a few pics of the aftermath. I got the hood mangled up when a dude went broadside in front of me in turn 2 and I had no where to go. The quarter panel got bashed in when a fellow tried to force his way under me in turn 1. Like I said before...those boys play rough.

[97-4doorGT]

quarter panel damage...

[92CamaroRS]

Originally posted by 97-4doorGT
Took the car to the track last night. I got there late and didn't get to practice at all....the first lap around the track was my qualifying lap. Anyhow I qualified slow, but that put me in the 3rd heat race. I won the heat race.

In the B-main feature I started 7th and finished 4th. Those boys play rough.

The car handles well, but I've got to find a way to force a 1st gear downshift. It's a short track that requires a very deep second gear or a real tall first gear. I'm carrying too much speed through the curves for the computer to allow a first gear downshift. But when I come out of the curves I'm only at 3000rpm in second gear...only at 3900rpm when I get to the next curve. I NEED TO GET THE RPM'S UP.



Anyhow, here's a few pics of the aftermath. I got the hood mangled up when a dude went broadside in front of me in turn 2 and I had no where to go. The quarter panel got bashed in when a fellow tried to force his way under me in turn 1. Like I said before...those boys play rough.

put a shorter tire on. or go taller and run first gear the entire time. but shorter tires generally fit better.

[97-4doorGT]

Originally posted by 92CamaroRS
put a shorter tire on. or go taller and run first gear the entire time. but shorter tires generally fit better.

I'd rather run taller tires and stretch out first gear. The problem is that I can't force this one to stay in first gear. This is an electronically controlled transmission and the shift points are operated by solenoids and signals from the ECM.

I'm considering a momentary switch hooked to the trans solenoid to control first-gear downshifts to see if that will lock it into first gear. If I can get the first-gear situation solved, then I'll consider swapping out side gears in the trans to find the ideal ratio.

[03grandam]

Not bad for the cars first time out,good job.

[FusionDreams]

Nice work, 4th place is solid for a first time. She's not dented too bad either, you're all set. lol.

[sunrunner_pei]

Can you leave the shift lever in '1' to keep it in 1st?

At any rate, congrats! You're not the first stock car GA on the GAOC forums, but it's rare for sure!!! I'll have to try and dig up some old threads from our other resident stocker. :thumbup2:

[ga5speed02]

good luck :thumbup:

[Matt95GT]

Nice :bigok:

Originally posted by sunrunner_pei
Can you leave the shift lever in '1' to keep it in 1st?


On that trans, the lowest gear on the shifter is combo 1/2.

Originally posted by 97-4doorGT
I'd rather run taller tires and stretch out first gear. The problem is that I can't force this one to stay in first gear. This is an electronically controlled transmission and the shift points are operated by solenoids and signals from the ECM.

I'm considering a momentary switch hooked to the trans solenoid to control first-gear downshifts to see if that will lock it into first gear. If I can get the first-gear situation solved, then I'll consider swapping out side gears in the trans to find the ideal ratio.

Yea... I'd try rigging some manual overrides. If you have OBD1.5, this should be of some help...
http://fazeshift.org/pics/albums/userpics/3100PCM/6E3-A-8.jpg
http://fazeshift.org/pics/albums/userpics/3100PCM/6E3-A-10.jpg

[sunrunner_pei]

Thanks for the clarification, Matt. I'm not very familiar with the 4th gens.

[Matt95GT]

Yea... I remember that quirk from my 94 3100 GT... you could drop it to the lowest gear, but it would stay in second until the PCM decided your RPM/speed was low enough to drop into first.

[92CamaroRS]

Originally posted by 97-4doorGT
I'd rather run taller tires and stretch out first gear. The problem is that I can't force this one to stay in first gear. This is an electronically controlled transmission and the shift points are operated by solenoids and signals from the ECM.

I'm considering a momentary switch hooked to the trans solenoid to control first-gear downshifts to see if that will lock it into first gear. If I can get the first-gear situation solved, then I'll consider swapping out side gears in the trans to find the ideal ratio.

you said yoru running a 3100, your gonna do nothing but hurt yourself by trying to hold 1st gear, the 3100 isnt a high reving engine, anything more than 6k is gonna hurt you.

[sunrunner_pei]

Yeah, but Cory, the drop from 1st to 2nd is enough to take the engine way out of it's peak powerband. I'm guessing this is a pretty short track, and you don't want to lose time by shifting all the time, trying to keep the engine at a speed that it makes good power.

[97-4doorGT]

Matt95GT - Thanks for the wiring info. I plan on trying to rig up a switch to force the downshift. I'll let people know how that works out.

I've also been checking in to changing the final drive ratio. The 4t60e has the bold on housing with the final drive unit. I've got a junk GAGT trans that I'm tearing down to figure out the number of gears in that final drive unit (2.92:1 by the RPO codes). And I've found a site (S&K Transmission Parts) that sells variouos FDR units for the 4t60e ($95-150). I just need to get a handle on how the gearing is set in the FDR unit.

I've changed side gears and the chain before on a 125c trans....That was pretty simple. I've got a extra 33:37 chain/sprocket combo. I'd just like to combine that with the deepest bolt-on FDR unit available. If I can set 3.73's under the car, the gearing will be almost ideal for 2nd gear.

[97-4doorGT]

Originally posted by 92CamaroRS
you said yoru running a 3100, your gonna do nothing but hurt yourself by trying to hold 1st gear, the 3100 isnt a high reving engine, anything more than 6k is gonna hurt you.

It's just a 1/4 mile oval....the straights are short and the curves are sharp. I really don't plan on over-revving the 3100. I'm just trying to find a ratio that keeps it in the power band.

I'll try an overide swtich, but I WILL have to allow it to shift to 2nd gear, otherwise I'll scatter pieces of 3100 all over the backstretch.

Ideally, I'd like not to shift at all. I built a 2.39:1 trans for a beretta once and the gearing was way too tall. On paper I think it topped out a 58mph in 1st gear.:eek:

[Dave C]

looks like you're having fun :)

keep us updated on what you're doing, its interesting.

[MantaGreen97]

Originally posted by Matt95GT
Yea... I remember that quirk from my 94 3100 GT... you could drop it to the lowest gear, but it would stay in second until the PCM decided your RPM/speed was low enough to drop into first.

Yeah, even on the 96-98s it does this as well. There's a "1" position on the shifter but if you rev it high enough it will shift into second. It won't shift out of second (you can bounce off the rev limiter in second gear with the shifter in either "1" or "2") but it will definitely shift out of first, even with the shifter in "1".

It was my understanding that even 99+ GAs (w/3400) would also behave the same. Am I mistaken there? Can you bounce the rev limiter in 1st on those cars???

Originally posted by 97-4doorGT
This is an electronically controlled transmission and the shift points are operated by solenoids and signals from the ECM.

I'm considering a momentary switch hooked to the trans solenoid to control first-gear downshifts to see if that will lock it into first gear. If I can get the first-gear situation solved, then I'll consider swapping out side gears in the trans to find the ideal ratio.
That's a good idea, as it will probably be cheap. However if the ECM still protests somehow, I would imagine there would have to be someone out there that could reprogram your ECM for different shift points. Might be a little pricey though, but not really a recognisable mod so you wouldn't get DQ'd for it I don't think (?)...

[04REDGT1]

That's really cool, hang in there.....Jeff

[Matt95GT]

Originally posted by MantaGreen97
I would imagine there would have to be someone out there that could reprogram your ECM for different shift points. Might be a little pricey though, but not really a recognisable mod so you wouldn't get DQ'd for it I don't think (?)...

Doubtful... OBD 1.5 is a pickle. Doubt there will ever be any means to reprogram it.

['96GAGT]

I thought it was going to be destroyed..

[97-4doorGT]

Originally posted by '96GAGT
I thought it was going to be destroyed..

Don't be so negative:mad:. It wouldn't make much sense to take a pretty car out on the circle track would it? It was a $200 dollar car that was junkyard bound before I got it running. Once I got it running I had two options....sell it and make a few hundred bucks or install a roll cage and have some fun. The decision was an easy one.

It'll be destroyed soon enough...I will run the car until it is nothing more than something that vaguely resembles a Grand Am. Untill then I'm going to get out there and rub fenders and swap paint with the rest of the boys.

You have your hobbies....don't knock mine. Later.

[92CamaroRS]

is it an Asphalt or Dirt track? i still think a smaller tire is your best option.

[OhioGrandAm]

Where are you racing at? Lorain Speedway had 2 Grand Am's at the track before it closed. They now race over at Sandusky.

[97-4doorGT]

I race at Barberton Speedway. It’s a ¼ mile asphalt oval. I’ve raced at bigger tracks, but this one is less than 5 miles from my house

The same weekend that my Grand Am made it’s debut to the track, another guy brought his Grand Am out for the first time as well. Both of us are running 1995 GASE V6 cars.

I most likely won’t be going back to the track this year. I’ve got a two year old little boy at home and my wife is due very, very soon with our second child. There are things more important than racing.

I just wanted to take it out for a “test drive”. Now that I’m sure that the engine and trans can handle the abuse, I’ll invest a bit more time into the car so it’s ready for next season. I want to experiment with the gearing while keeping the engine legal.

[goredsox]

to bad you cant have the 3300 with the 3.1 limit... Because with the three speed tranny she tops out at about 55 in first gear... even with it in D she will still downshift to 1st as long as you are going less than 45... to combat that just slip her into 1st... :)

you guys are talking about the rev limiter what exactly is that??? Because i did a no no once, she redlines at 5500, but i put her into 1st to see if i could hit 6000... around 5700 she toped out... making that wierd sound...

in D she will shift around 5100, so putting her in 1st i can shift to 2nd at the 5500 rpm redline... i guess the three speed isnt electronically controlled...

[gerald]

three speed guys FTW!! yeah i dont think the three speed is electronically controlled. but then again it will shift into second, and then quick into third if your just cruising at like 45-50.

[goredsox]

Originally posted by gerald
three speed guys FTW!! yeah i dont think the three speed is electronically controlled. but then again it will shift into second, and then quick into third if your just cruising at like 45-50.

:woot: even though she is kinda slow i still love my baby with the three speed...

[NewNann]

Not sure if anyones pointed this out to you, or you know the exact numbers yet but the 4t60e holds 1st gear to ~41mph/5400rpm, and then won't shift out of second (it'll just bounce off of the 6K rev limit), it also will NOT go back to 1st gear until you go below ~22mph........ that's low enough that you'll be stuck at LOW rpm in 2nd (no power). Just thought I'd let you know how long you'll be waiting for it to downshift each time.

[gerald]

Originally posted by goredsox
:woot: even though she is kinda slow i still love my baby with the three speed...

imagine a 4 speed auto...or...5 speed manual...mmm...that would haul.

[97-4doorGT]

Originally posted by NewNann
Not sure if anyones pointed this out to you, or you know the exact numbers yet but the 4t60e holds 1st gear to ~41mph/5400rpm, and then won't shift out of second (it'll just bounce off of the 6K rev limit), it also will NOT go back to 1st gear until you go below ~22mph........ that's low enough that you'll be stuck at LOW rpm in 2nd (no power). Just thought I'd let you know how long you'll be waiting for it to downshift each time.

Thanks for the info about the shiftpoints. The only times I managed to get a downshift was when the other cars would bunch-up (crash) and we would slow down just abit through the curves....it's only a 1/4mile oval and the curves are TIGHT with

We go into the tight corners at about 55-60mph and come out at about 35mph. It seems slow, but when you're running door to door with 20 cars it can be a rush.

I've done some calcs and I think that I would be better off to try and stretch out first gear ONLY IF I can figure out a way to manually control the downshift solenoid to stay in first gear. I think I can change the side sprockets on this tranny pretty easily...done it on a Beretta. I can get all the parts for a 3.73 FDR conversion, but then I think I'll be low on the RPM's for second gear and insanely tight to even think about a downshift.

But my racing season is over......the new baby came to see us 7 weeks early.....got more important things to take care of right now. I work on the car over the winter and plan for next season.

[GrandAmSSE]

Just wondering what kind of line you taking around the track? Is it dirt or asphalt. I run barefoot minnis at a local track. Only FWD cars. I race a 89 ford escort. Anyways your best line would be this. Start by the wall, cut down to the bottom entering the first turn and when exiting come back out to the wall. I pinched off all the brake but the drivers front to help me slide into the corners. I'm a second gen dirttrack myself. Heres a pic of my dads car.

[97-4doorGT]

Originally posted by GrandAmSSE
Just wondering what kind of line you taking around the track? Is it dirt or asphalt. I run barefoot minnis at a local track. Only FWD cars. I race a 89 ford escort. Anyways your best line would be this. Start by the wall, cut down to the bottom entering the first turn and when exiting come back out to the wall. I pinched off all the brake but the drivers front to help me slide into the corners. I'm a second gen dirttrack myself. Heres a pic of my dads car.

Asphalt.....the rest of the track details are in earlier posts to this thread.

I've got the line down, that's not a problem.

I'd like to try running dirt, but the closest dirt track only allows 4-cylinder (and they allow fuk'n jap cars). So I'm only a spectator at that track.

[GrandAmSSE]

Learn ashalt and then if you want to go wild run dirt. Its harder to learn in reverse.

[97-4doorGT]

Originally posted by GrandAmSSE
Learn ashalt and then if you want to go wild run dirt. Its harder to learn in reverse.

I've already learned asphalt....got a shelf full of feature win trophies to prove it. I've raced at Barberton, Midvale and Mansfield.

Dirt sounds like fun, but I only race at Barberton because it's less than 5 miles from my house. Wayne County Speedway is 15 miles away and they only allow 4-cylinder cars. They run DOHC rice-burners and hot little domestics....I know of a 180hp Beretta GTZ and a 2003 DOHC Neon that race there....can't compete with that on my budget.

The only thing I HATE about dirt track racing is the DIRT. It's awesome to see a car pitched sideways and slide broadside through a curve....almost on the brink of disaster, but I like going to the races and coming home clean.

"It's harder to learn in reverse".....never thought about racing in reverse.

Later.

[jordanGT]

You haven't been to a real race unless you have to wash yourself and your cooler immediately upon returning home :P j/k...kinda...