We need to fix the stickies here.

[loud2kse]

Most of the stickies here have some really outdated info, so I was wondering if you want someone to update them. I can offer a lot of info for this section, and wouldn't mind doing a writeup for people. Shoot, make me a mod of this section, and I'll make sure we get a lot of really good info in here on a regular basis. Just thought I'd see if people were interested on the info in here being more "well-compiled"

feedback welcome. :)


edit: not bashing the mods or admins here AT ALL. I love this site, you guys do a great job, and I have been here a loooong time, but I want this section to get a little more active. I believe this is the best powerplant for the GA's (flame suit) lol and wanna get more people into modding it.

[sunrunner_pei]

Mike, if you have any specific info to add or change, let me or one of the section mods know and we'll do what we can. I personally don't know much about the 2.4L, so we rely on our membership to provide good information. :)

[loud2kse]

will do. I'll try and give you the changes that need to be made to the stickies first, and then do a write-up of a bunch of other stuff later

[DontPassTheFence]

I concur, the LD9 is THE BEST motor you can get with a later model Grand Am.

[matt rupke]

Originally posted by DontPassTheFence
I concur, the LD9 is THE BEST motor you can get with a later model Grand Am.

x2:bananna:

[Ralph]

X3

[loud2kse]

2.4L performance websites.

this sticky here http://www.gaownersclub.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=22864

www.rksport.com ----still good
www.mantapart.com ------- meh, they have a real problem getting their parts out to their customers, and have earned a bad reputation
www.rsmracing.com ------ now called z-spec, I will not say anything about them because they are a sponsor
www.highrevmotorsports.com ------- no longer exists
www.vizzionpower.com ------- no longer exists
www.americanproductsofcolorado.com ------- not sure if they're still around, but the link doesn't work.
www.pfyc.com ---- still good
www.induction-dynamics.com ----- still good for an overpriced intake
www.dragevolution2200.com ------ no longer exists
www.izuzuperformance.com ------- the name is spelled wrong it should be www.iSuzuperformance.com --- still good but really only for the UD pulley and flywheel
www.aleroupgrades.com/performance.htm ------ no longer exists

and of course there are a lot of new sites out there catering to the LD9, which I will post a few of later.

[loud2kse]

this sticky http://www.gaownersclub.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=264

says post up if you have any knowledge about making the 2.4 faster, but it's a locked thread, and only has one reply with one link in it, and the link doesn't work.

[loud2kse]

this sticky here is good http://www.gaownersclub.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1978 except the 99 and pelow LD9s have 9.5:1 cr instead of 9.7

we should take this thread http://www.gaownersclub.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=68175 and put it in here for all you pre 00 guys wanting some reliable boost



crud, sorry bout the triple posting, I should just be editing that first post. oops

[VanishingImage]

also,any write ups on the "secret cam swap"

Im thinking about pursuing this and wouldn't mind seeing/finding some more info from anyone that has ACTUALLY did the swap. Not just what parts but like a small walk through

[loud2kse]

sure.

I haven't done it myself, but can get all the info compiled for us. I know it's a good gain, and worth the time/parts. Gimme a bit to get all my sources together, cuz I'm trying to put that, plus the 2.3 oil pump swap, plus a compilation for people wanting to boost these motors alltogether into one spot. it's just taking some time to make sure I point out all the details and whatnot.

[townie15]

MAKE HIM A MOD!!!!!!!!

[VanishingImage]

yea man take your time,no rush on it. Need to take my front bumper off now because it needs fixed....hehe read my thread in the appearence mod section

[Matt95GT]

It's gonna be dreadfully slow at work next week... post any other changes that need to be made and I'll update the stickies then. Thanks for the help. :)

[loud2kse]

sure.

like I said gimme a lil time to get everything together.

[loud2kse]

Here is a pretty comprehensive tutorial on the secret cam swap.
thanks go out to ny-jbodies.org for this writeup.

keep in mind that you *should* replace your lifters when doing this swap. Some people don't, but it is highly advised, and the directions from GM on installing new cams say that you should do it to

now on to the tutorial.


The 2.3 Quad 4 engines had better camshafts, even over stock for the newer 2.4 . The 2.3 and 2.4 are very similar in design, but have some very different parts in them both. Lucky for us the camshaft towers (where the camshafts sit), are the same for both engines and there fore are the same cam shafts. So we can use Quad 4 cams in the LD9 as upgrades. Now what makes this swap a bit different is that the new 2.4 engines have the power steering pump hex shaft machined with the input for the camshaft position to the intake camshaft. Now with the 2.3 the setup is different except for the year 95', where the camshaft has been machined for the hex shaft that drives the power steering pump mounted to the back of the engine and has an input for the cam position sensor, which is the same as the 2.4. For this swap you need the 95 2.3L intake camshaft, *VIN D #24574239 and the LO (LD2) 93-94 Quad 4 exhaust cam, *VIN D #24570698.

Ok here are the spec's on the stock camshafts for the 2.4, 2.3 LO, 2.3 HO, 2.3 W41, Mantapart, and Genertec XX5 Camshaft Spec's. When you compare the stock 2.4 cam specs to the 2.3 you can see that for the most part are close but when you take the 95' 2.3 intake camshaft (you can only use this one because it has the hex for the power steering pump and camshaft position sensor) it has 200 degrees @ .050" with .360" lift. The Stock 2.4 has 198 degrees @ .050" with .354" lift. The 95' 2.3 has higher lift than the 2.4 and rotates 2 degrees more. Now when you look at the 90' 2.3 exhaust camshaft, it has 200 degrees @ .050" with .375" lift and the 2.4 has 187 degrees @ .050" with .346" lift. The 2.3 has a much higher lift than the 2.4 and rotates 13 degrees more. When combined together you can see any where from 10 hp to 20 hp depending on your modifications to your engine. The idle is perfect and the ECM needs no modifications. On a side note for those who would like to replace the lifters (which is recommended by all) is that the bore of the lifters is 33.0mm for 95' 2.3 and 96' 2.4, and the bore of the older 2.3's is 35.0mm.

1995 Cam Specs
200 degrees @ .050" with .360" lift for the intake
LD2 (1990+) Cam Specs
200 degrees @ .050" with .375" lift for the exhaust

See how close the 95 2.3 intake and the 2.3 LO Exhaust camshaft are to each other.

Camshaft Spec's

Stock 2.4 LD9 Cam Specs
198 degrees @ .050" with .354" lift for the intake
187 degrees @ .050" with .346" lift for the exhaust

Stock 2.3 LD2 (1989) Cam Specs
212 degrees @ .050" with .345" lift for the intake
212 degrees @ .050" with .345" lift for the exhaust

Stock 2.3 1995 Cam Specs
200 degrees @ .050" with .360" lift for the intake
200 degrees @ .050" with .360" lift for the exhaust

Stock 2.3 LD2 (1990) Cam Specs
200 degrees @ .050" with .375" lift for the intake
200 degrees @ .050" with .375" lift for the exhaust

Stock 2.3 HO cams Specs
212 degrees @ .050" with .410" lift for the intake
212 degrees @ .050" with .410" lift for the exhaust

Stock 2.3 W41 cams Specs
218 degrees @ .050" with .410" lift for the intake
218 degrees @ .050" with .410" lift for the exhaust

Mantapart Mild Cams Specs
198 degrees @ .050" with .360" lift for the intake
201 degrees @ .050" with .374" lift for the exhaust

Genertec XX5 Specs
211 degrees @ .050" with .360" lift for the intake
212 degrees @ .050" with .360" lift for the exhaust


How to do this:

Here are the exact directions from GM on how to remove and install camshafts.

Intake camshaft removal/install (http://www.ny-jbodies.org/library/engine/2.4/2.4camsecret/2.4intakecam.htm)

Exhaust Camshaft removal/install (http://www.ny-jbodies.org/library/engine/2.4/2.4camsecret/2.4exhaustcam.htm)



Optional Parts (Gaskets, etc...)

*12355988 - Intake or exhaust cam carrier gaskets (upper and lower)
*12363173 - Intake or exhaust cam carrier gaskets (upper and lower)
*24575512 - Tensioner. Not required, but if you have timing chain noise, change this. Also, be sure you are familiar with how this part works because it has to be pre-loaded once installed to snug up the timing chain.
*24575513 - Tensioner shoe. This will probably break when you remove, so change it anyway.
*24575255 - Guide. Not required unless yours are worn.
*24575257 - Guide. Same as above.
*24575256 - Guide. Same as above.
*992704 - Assembly Lube. Good idea to coat the cam lobes and the carriers where the cam contacts with this stuff.
*992869 - Oil supplement. The GM manual calls for this stuff when you do the cams.
*12360464 - Timing chain cover gasket. (optional)

[loud2kse]

hey, quad4forums has a really good set of pics for the 2.3 oil pump conversion. I know the pics came from a guy on j-body.org but should I link the pics from there, or attatch them here?

[Matt95GT]

Originally posted by loud2kse
hey, quad4forums has a really good set of pics for the 2.3 oil pump conversion. I know the pics came from a guy on j-body.org but should I link the pics from there, or attatch them here?

Hmmm... It would be best if these are new write-ups (vs exact copies) or updates to existing links/info. People tend to get very territorial about their "how-to's" and pics if they get copied from forum to forum. It would be best to avoid that... although I know that's hard to do so tactfully.

In other words, this section shouldn't turn into an exact copy of j-body.org and Quad4forums.com stickies... but more of a guide to finding this info, accurate updates to existing info/links etc.

[DontPassTheFence]

the only problem I see is that you cant see pics @ q4f if you arent a member, I think... so linking would only be so useful... a whole new write-up would be great, but I dont know of anyone patient or extremely generous enough to catalog an entire weekend's worth of cam-swapping fun.

[VanishingImage]

wouldn't really need pics for the cam swap,just generalized steps. Im pretty good when it comes to mechanical work so if I get a push in a direction I can follow

But yea doing new write ups would be best as long as the person that originally did the write is given credit or what not

[loud2kse]

the cam swap writeup I posted above is from ny-jbodies.com and has links to the gm instructions on how to change cams. The 2.3 oil pump swap is a BIG job, and I haven't done it, but we need to at least have the info on this site.

the thread from q4f is pretty much just pics of the swap, no instructions. And the pics he got were from a guy on the .org that offered the pics to pretty much anyone that wanted to have
them.

I definitely don't have the time to do entirely new writeups, so should I just compile links, or compile the info and give credit where due?

[VanishingImage]

links FTW!:D

[loud2kse]

Originally posted by VanishingImage
links FTW!:D

the only thing that is stopping me from doing links for the cam swap and the 2.3 oil pump conversion, is that the best writeups are on ny-jbodies.org, but the site doesn't have a specific url (or whatever) when you go to the libraries. see for yourself.... go to www.ny-jbodies.org then click library, and go to anything in the 2.4 section. Then look at the address bar and it still just reads http://www.ny-jbodies.org/

however, here's a good link for the oil pump conversion. If you scroll down to the 8th post there's a writeup on 2 different ways to go about it. http://www.j-body.org/forums/read.php?f=2&i=316066&t=316066#316066

here's a place that you can get the modified oil pan from http://www.miller-performance.com/products.html

here's the guy you can get the pics from for the conversion. http://www.j-body.org/members/john317/

here's a good place to get parts from for the 2.4 http://www.ryne.com/ he does a lot more eco parts, but if you ask him for something, he can get it, and has great service, and good prices

another place for parts. Never dealt with them, but they have some good stuff from what it looks like http://www.jbodyperformance.com/new/newIndex.php
clevitte bearings, ARP studs, eagle rods, crankshafts plus crankshaft services, neutral balance shafts, intank fuel pumps, MSD, intake manifolds, 2.4 performance head, wiseco pistons, total seal gapless rings, cams, lifters, intake, throttle body, WOW, they really have a lot of stuff listed.


these guys have some real nice looking mounts http://www.turbotechracing.com/productcart/pc/home.asp and from what I hear they are working on some new products as well. They seem to have a good rep in the j-body community too.

now let's not forget about hptuners..... there really should be a whole seperate 2.4 tuning section in here for this, because there's a lot you can do. and anyone with a 97+ car can use this. (sorry Matt) lol once I get it, i'll be tooling around with it quite a bit, and posting what I find, but theres a world of things you can do now that it's available for us.

well so far at least here is a general list of some helpful links for us, this way I've got a lot of goodies in one spot so I won't have to backtrack to find it. I can go into more detail, but I'm not sure how everyone wants this info organized. I know how I want it organized, but I'm not a mod here so, I don't have liberty to do as I see fit. more to come soon though! :)

[DontPassTheFence]

http://www.ny-jbodies.org/forum/links.asp?action=goto&id=42

I think Ive got it for the 2.3 oil pump conversion link, however they use ASP (or ASP.NET) both which are annoying M$ markup languages and have no rhyme or reason about them.

[loud2kse]

sweet. I think I got it now.

heres the one for the cams http://www.ny-jbodies.org/library/engine/2.4/2.4camsecret/2.4camsecret.asp

and here's a good place to learn about or ask about hptuners http://www.4cyltuner.com/Forum/

[Sweet98GA]

FYI- i'll be doing an entire write up / install of the s/c when we do it. The car is going to get dyno'd Thursday (base run) so that will be part of it as well.

I wrote up a 5 page how to install guide on aed's site for their kit. While the install won't be of much use, the tear down might as the way to take the car apart is going to be the same, no matter what kit you use, and it has pictures and is completely accurate. I'm not sure if you guys (shawn & kelly) want to host all the pics though. They are at full size res, and about 350-600k each. I however cannot access that part of the site, so if a member from over there (loud2k cough cough) wants to pull the thread, its in the 96-98 section, prolly under installs, user name = sweet98gagt.

[loud2kse]

I can find it if you want me to, but what do you want me to do with it? copy the text, or the pics, or both, or what?

[loud2kse]

Originally posted by loud2kse
I can find it if you want me to, but what do you want me to do with it? copy the text, or the pics, or both, or what?

^^^^^^^Gus?

[99GrandAMSE]

Originally posted by Sweet98GA
... I'm not sure if you guys (shawn & kelly) want to host all the pics though. They are at full size res, and about 350-600k each ...

Lets talk about it ... if it going to be helpful to the site and its members, I am all for hosting whatever I can ... send me information on what yhou need from me and I'll see if I can make it happen ... you know me Gus, always willing to help :)

[litdevil316]

http://www.jbodyperformance.com/new/newIndex.php

good bunch of ppl. where i got my new p/p head, cams, rods, pistons, barrings. they even had the head matched to the 0.020 over pistons. head came with all vavletrain. thing to be carefull about with them is, they sent everything into the mail, but the cams. they were waiting on me to either send my old cams to them for regrind, or for them to get a pair of cams from some one else to get to me. they are helpfull ppl. i was in Iraq when i placed the order and eveything was mailed to my moms place in maryland. and they are based out of canada.

[loud2kse]

FYI- i'll be doing an entire write up / install of the s/c when we do it. The car is going to get dyno'd Thursday (base run) so that will be part of it as well.

I wrote up a 5 page how to install guide on aed's site for their kit. While the install won't be of much use, the tear down might as the way to take the car apart is going to be the same, no matter what kit you use, and it has pictures and is completely accurate. I'm not sure if you guys (shawn & kelly) want to host all the pics though. They are at full size res, and about 350-600k each. I however cannot access that part of the site, so if a member from over there (loud2k cough cough) wants to pull the thread, its in the 96-98 section, prolly under installs, user name = sweet98gagt.


here's a bump for ya ;)

http://www.aedcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=629

[spy]

here's a bump for ya ;)

http://www.aedcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=629

you have to join to see anything.

[loud2kse]

dammit. ok well if gus ever chimes in i'll ask him if he wants me to copy/paste his info over here.... it was more or less to do with appearance modds, but it's good info.