Head gasket or head That is the question

[Badiroc]

I did a search for my problem but nothing quite matches. 1993 Grand Am Gt. Very cold this week in Ohio and my teenage son ( who's car this is) tells me he had no heat one day? Should raise a question you would think! Then he says it was almost in the red on his way home from work. I got both statements at the same time. I replaced water pump but then noticed water leaking from middle rear exhaust manifold tube. ( And whover had been there before forgot to put a gasket on it). So i know its head gasket, possible cracked head or cracked block. I guess my question is if a block or head is cracked will you visually see it.( and i do not see anything). Heads are off the car and alll the valves are a pinkish color. Not black like carbon but pink like burnt dex-cool. Cylinder walls look good still has hone marks in it. I would hate to put all the money and labor into this if the head or block is cracked.

[Pizzon]

Gah.. had the same problem. with a 94.

it depends on how bad... i would advise you to take it to a shop with a head machine computer that scans the head surfaces for cracks. since you already have the heads off, might as well do it. not sure how much it costs, but itll save you tine in the long run, for sure. the pinkish color is probaly fluid that leaked due to the blown gasket.

[rixGAphx]

Almost certainly not the block.

In any case, take both heads to a machine shop, tell them the tale, and ask for a standard 3-angle valve job.
Authorize them to re-use as many parts as possible (valves, springs, valve spring retainers, rocker arms).
New keepers of course; new valve guides and seats if applicable to your engine.
Should be about $125 / head.

Their first step will be to vat-clean and magnaflux the heads, possibly while they're still assembled.
The magnafluxing will reveal any crack(s), and you and the shop can decide on a direction.
Completely-rebuilt heads are available over teh internet, mebbe $250 for the 3.3? I dunno.

It is possible that a warped head has caused a 'blown' headgasket. Coolant can seep into a cylinder, then it's blown out thru the exhaust.
In any case, crack (usually non-repairable) or no, the heads need to be checked for flatness using straight-edges and feeler gages much finer than a home mechanic has access to.
The shop can mill the head(s) as required for trueness. Mebbe 1/16" (0.060, sixty-thousandths).

Good luck,
-Rick

[Badiroc]

Machinist by trade I got access to very fine measuring equiptment. Any one know specs for head surface????

[Pizzon]

slightest idea... its a 3100 sfi? if not what engine? i can prolly find out, my uncle owns a shop

[thegrimone]

call/drop by the dealer and ask?

for the 3400 max "OK" warpage is .005, if more than .010 must be removed, replace the head.

[rixGAphx]

He has the 3.3, from '93.

Completely different engine than the 2.8/3.1/3.4 family of 60* V6 engines.

[Pizzon]

Originally posted by rixGAphx
He has the 3.3, from '93.

Completely different engine than the 2.8/3.1/3.4 family of 60* V6 engines.

Yeah just noticed that. Go with the guy above, ill ask my uncle's mechanics anyway just to get exactly.

[thegrimone]

yeah that is why is said for the 3400, just to give him reference, it can't be much more different, a head on any motor is most likely this close of a tolerance, just to make sure of a good seal.

[Badiroc]

I boasted about the facotry service manuals in an earlier post about chiltons and haynes versus The factory manual. I must say i will eat these words as i have a factory service manual now and it gvies me nothing on the head surface flatness. I guess all things are not perfect except my wife, ask her ;)~~. Any info is extremely helpfull. Thanks for all the posts. Will visit a dealer tomorrow for specs but think they would pull it from the factory manual too.