metal in oil, 2.4 GM

[michialj]

Hello,

I have a 2000 grand am with a 2.4. Tonight when I changed oil, I noticed iron/steel powder and flakes on the magnet. :eek: Anybody have any experience with anything like this? I couldn't seem to find any relevant posts, so here goes...

Thanks a ton!

mj

[VanishingImage]

how big are the "flakes" ? If they are a good size,more than just little hair thin size than I say you have some internal problems with the motor.

[michialj]

Ok, let me be a little more specific. The flakes are small, less than half a mil, and most of what I found was nearly powder. Being located in the engine, I understand that said flakes are a sign of some sort of internal engine problem, and due to thier ferrous nature, are not from a bearing.

What I would like to know, is does anyone have experience with or know of any sort of common items that generate this type of wear, such as time chain, cam, or oil pump issues or perhaps a wrist pin backing out. The car only has 130k, so I would imagine if this one has issues, so have many more.

Thanks again!

[michialj]

I ask around, turns out GM has has the same problem with all of their 4 bangers starting with the quad 4. the timing chain and gears are junk. they are the source of metal in the oil almost everytime. I pulled the timing cover off, and sure enough, the crank gear was starting to get a little rough. the whole deal cost around $230 180 for the timing set, 40 for the gasket, and tax. plus a shop manual for 13 bucks (it is a must for timing the car). you will need a socket set, jack and stands, torque wrench, gear puller, 2 M8X125 (i think, may be different thread) bolts to thread into the main pulley to pull it off and to use again to hold cam gears in place while timing. An impact gun is very useful in removing crank pulley bolt. My gasket set came with crank seal, so don't make the mistake I did of buying one separately as well.

As far as the process, stick the car on the stands, pull off the right front wheel, put the jack under the engine, and remove a couple of Christmas tree clips that hold the part of the inner fender between the wheel and the engine. No need to remove completely, just let it dangle. remove the cruise module, motor mounts, belt, pulley, timing cover. I had to tap the threads in the pulley as they were rusted up in order to get the m8 bolts in to pull it off. the plastic tensioner shoe was brittle and broke when i tried to remove it with snap ring pliers, so just reach in with a chisle and hammer and split that bad boy off on the back side. follow the manual for timing and setting up the new tensioner, and you should be good to go. you will have to move the engine up/down to access everthing, such as getting a puller on the pulley and tightening the bolts back.

All in all, it takes probably 4 to 6 hours if you are like me and don't exactly know what you are doing, and didn't have the book to start with. If you do not have a gear puller or air tools, this will be a tough job. Probably not a great first project to attempt on your daily driver, as an error in cam timing can cost an engine, but if you pull it off is much cheaper than a shop, and whats a little risk any how?

If you are reading this, good luck, I hope this helps someone. It is bound to be more useful the comments captain obvious made in order to achieve "postimus maximus" status.:D

[spy]

is this the first time you changed the oil on this car? is the car running weird? or just "off"?

[infernus]

Oooo. Keep a magnet stuck to your oil filter until you figure out whats up. That sounds nasty. Only times I ever saw chunks of shit in my oil was when it was babbit/pieces of main bearing.

[theMessenjah44]

130k is getting pretty close...mine threw a camshaft bearing at...140k~....mechanic told me it would be 1700 to fix it, or 2100 to put in a different engine...so we did the engine swap....

[spy]

quads don't have a camshaft bearing.

we have rod bearings and main bearings this i know and have seen as well as bearings for the balance shafts. But nope no sir no camshaft bearings have i seen in my life, nor heard of.

[VanishingImage]

I ask around, turns out GM has has the same problem with all of their 4 bangers starting with the quad 4. the timing chain and gears are junk. they are the source of metal in the oil almost everytime. I pulled the timing cover off, and sure enough, the crank gear was starting to get a little rough. the whole deal cost around $230 180 for the timing set, 40 for the gasket, and tax. plus a shop manual for 13 bucks (it is a must for timing the car). you will need a socket set, jack and stands, torque wrench, gear puller, 2 M8X125 (i think, may be different thread) bolts to thread into the main pulley to pull it off and to use again to hold cam gears in place while timing. An impact gun is very useful in removing crank pulley bolt. My gasket set came with crank seal, so don't make the mistake I did of buying one separately as well.

As far as the process, stick the car on the stands, pull off the right front wheel, put the jack under the engine, and remove a couple of Christmas tree clips that hold the part of the inner fender between the wheel and the engine. No need to remove completely, just let it dangle. remove the cruise module, motor mounts, belt, pulley, timing cover. I had to tap the threads in the pulley as they were rusted up in order to get the m8 bolts in to pull it off. the plastic tensioner shoe was brittle and broke when i tried to remove it with snap ring pliers, so just reach in with a chisle and hammer and split that bad boy off on the back side. follow the manual for timing and setting up the new tensioner, and you should be good to go. you will have to move the engine up/down to access everthing, such as getting a puller on the pulley and tightening the bolts back.

All in all, it takes probably 4 to 6 hours if you are like me and don't exactly know what you are doing, and didn't have the book to start with. If you do not have a gear puller or air tools, this will be a tough job. Probably not a great first project to attempt on your daily driver, as an error in cam timing can cost an engine, but if you pull it off is much cheaper than a shop, and whats a little risk any how?

If you are reading this, good luck, I hope this helps someone. It is bound to be more useful the comments captain obvious made in order to achieve "postimus maximus" status.:D


who was the captian obvious directed to????? Plus being on a forum for 5-6 years you get to that postimus maximus status :roll2:

[spy]

This guy is weird. Postimus maximus has nothing to do with knowing anything with knowledge of an engine. That's completely unrelated, and an unwaranted jab at someone.

[VanishingImage]

first asks for help than throws my help back in my face,thanks,go somewhere else