how to check cam timing

[ventport]

I just bought a 99 GA with a 2.4 that was in a mild front end accident. Rearended another vehical at hood level, the radiator is still full of coolent. It was obviously running before the accident, but now I can't get it started. It tries to start but it back fires and sounds like it's out of time. Is there an easy way to see if the timing chain has jumped? Where is the cam sensor located? I have no way of knowing how long it sat after the accident and have no history of the car. It has 104,000 miles on it and 4 new tires, so the previous owner must have thought it would go a while longer or they wouldn't have bought new tires for it. Any other ideas or help will be appreciated. Thanks Brian

[Matt95GT]

The mechanical trauma required to make the timing chain jump would probably be enough to destroy the whole engine/car... so I doubt that's your problem. The cam position sensor is under the "T" in "Twin Cam" Here:
http://www.gaownersclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=16435&d=1117058109

First I would check the obvious... mechanical damage to the engine, the sensors and wiring harness. Then I would start with the usual 2.4 ignition system diagnosis. Things to troubleshoot:
spark plugs (age, proper gap, brand - use stock AC Delco)
coil housing - check for signs of arcing or cracks
check plug boots for deterioration
bad connections to IDI module, etc
After that, coils and IDI module would need to be tested.

[ventport]

I checked and have good spark and good plugs. Tried the passkey stuff about turning the key on for 12 minutes then off then try to start. It cranks and fires and when you hold the gas pedal to the floor it fires a lot and almost starts with an ocasional back fire. Is there an easy way to check the timing chain to see if it jumped? Where is the test port to check the fuel pressure, I have looked and have not found one. There appears that there is no damage to any wiring or anything else on the engine as it was not hit that hard. Nothing from the front hit the engine, and the radiator and air conditioner condensor are both still fine. Where is the fuel filter located? Any other thoughts as to what to look for or check next? Thanks Brian

[spy]

Fuel filter is in the rear of the car by the fuel tank. There is no fuel pressure test port on the LD9 motor either. You'll have to fab up something yourself.

[Ralph]

I checked and have good spark and good plugs. Tried the passkey stuff about turning the key on for 12 minutes then off then try to start. It cranks and fires and when you hold the gas pedal to the floor it fires a lot and almost starts with an ocasional back fire. Is there an easy way to check the timing chain to see if it jumped? Where is the test port to check the fuel pressure, I have looked and have not found one. There appears that there is no damage to any wiring or anything else on the engine as it was not hit that hard. Nothing from the front hit the engine, and the radiator and air conditioner condensor are both still fine. Where is the fuel filter located? Any other thoughts as to what to look for or check next? Thanks Brian

That is the exact thing that happened to me a few weeks ago when I needed a new Coilpack

[ventport]

That is the exact thing that happened to me a few weeks ago when I needed a new Coilpack

Do you mean that when you had the top cover for the engine turned upside down on top of the engine, with the spark plugs plugged in and grounded, that when you cranked the engine the plugs sparked with a hot spark, and the coil packs were still bad? That is how I tested mine. Is this what you are talking about? Last night I tried cranking the engine and spraying starting fluid into the throttle body with the same result, it would fire but not run and only fire when I held the gas pedal to the floor. I would think this would eliminate fuel as the problem as it should have started by spraying either into the air intake. Thanks for any input. Brian

[Ralph]

Do you mean that when you had the top cover for the engine turned upside down on top of the engine, with the spark plugs plugged in and grounded, that when you cranked the engine the plugs sparked with a hot spark, and the coil packs were still bad? That is how I tested mine. Is this what you are talking about? Last night I tried cranking the engine and spraying starting fluid into the throttle body with the same result, it would fire but not run and only fire when I held the gas pedal to the floor. I would think this would eliminate fuel as the problem as it should have started by spraying either into the air intake. Thanks for any input. Brian

I don't quite understand what you are doing right here since you say you have the top part turned over which is the ignition / coilpack I do see how the plugs could fire. It would be the same effect as not plugging in that top part. It would just crank and nothing else.

[ventport]

That is how I tested the ignition to find out if the plugs were fireing. I turned the top part with the coil packs upside down, while still plugged into the wiring harness. Inserted the spark plugs into the coil packs and grounded the base of each plug. When I cranked the engine all the plugs would fire with a good bright spark, so I assumed the coil packs are allright. Is this a good way to check the coil packs? What else could cause my symptoms? How can I see if the timing chain is OK with out taking the engine all apart?

[Ralph]

O ok its early and i was thinking backwards. Really easy to test bring it to autozone and they will test it :lol:

[tenspeed]

That is how I tested the ignition to find out if the plugs were fireing.

Sounds like a good way to test the coils.

Since it is firing with either, I would check the fuel system. Starting fluid will fire for a short burst until it's used up. Listen for sounds of the fuel pump running when the key is turned to the "On" position. It should run for a couple of seconds until the fuel rail is pressurized.

You shouldn't have to hold the pedal to the floor unless it's flooded. If it is flooded, the plugs should look wet.

[ventport]

How can I see if the timing chain is OK and the cams in time with out taking the engine all apart? The way it tries to start and back fires it sounds to me like it has jumped time.

[Matt95GT]

How can I see if the timing chain is OK and the cams in time with out taking the engine all apart? The way it tries to start and back fires it sounds to me like it has jumped time.

You can't. It's a major procedure to remove the timing chain cover. And as we stated, it isn't going the be the timing chain. I doubt it would even crank if it "jumped" as the valves would be contacting the pistons.