fuel filter changed,still loss of power.

[Dawniepoo]

Hey there guys long time no probs till now! K a few days ago my car lost an extreme amount of horsepower. So hubby changed the fuel filter.Runs a lot better now BUT! still loss of horse power still doesn't want to go like when i tried to pass a car my boy didn't want to move ran all the way up to 4000rpm and still nothing..goes fine normal but when it comes petal to the metal nothing. And I took it out for a test run,safety check cause hubby has a long drive tomorrow morn and bam what do my eyes see a solid service engine soon light. I am so frustrated. Could it be that maybe all I need is to reset the ECU or is there still a prob like the fuel pump?I checked the gas cap, spark plugs wires air filter,*that was dirty but cleaned it* So to recap, loss of power still but hardly no more sputtering, solid service engine soon light. New fuel filter. Im ready to dump this bad boy over a bridge.lol It's our only car but all of the sudden everything is going wrong with it. Please help me guys!

Thanks
Dawniepoo

[OneFstGt]

Have you checked the ses code? May be the catalytic converter...Just trying to help, hope you figure it out soon... Take care

[rixGAphx]

'02 V6, 6-yrs old, mebbe 75k miles?
Symptoms:
* Sudden decrease in power, improved by new FF but still gutless;
* THEN the SES came 'on'.
* Revs to 4000, but has 'no power'. Huh?

Non-symptoms (since you don't mention them as problems):
* Starts fine.
* No roughness at idle.
* No noticable 'misfire'.
* Not running hot (or cold).
* No idiot lights other than SES.

DEFINITELY get the codes scanned for the SES (for free, at Checker/AutoZone/etc.) and report back here.
Do NOT buy whatever part is indicated by the code.

Possibly a failing (but not-quite failED) fuel pump, but the symptoms aren't quite right and a faulty FP itself won't throw a code.

More likely to be a failed Fuel Pressure Regulator, not allowing the higher pressure necessary for 2000+ rpm.
The FPR won't throw a code either.
But either one (FP or FPR) can result in P030x 'misfires'.

Completely remove the air cleaner element and drive for a few miles (won't hurt, as long as you aren't driving thru a Sahara sandstorm) to see if the problem disappears.

Standing by,
-Rick

[Dawniepoo]

HAHA thanks Rick ok wish me luck bout to do that and go around the block a few times. Will get back I hope asap. I trust ya though you've always done me right. brb.;)

Dawniepoo

[Dawniepoo]

Ok Rick I made it back done what you suggested and yes the SES light turned off,I went home put the air filter back in started the car back up took off BUT were right back where I started as to now he won't go, struggling at trying to get up to 20mph doing normal at 2000rpm. But it's a struggle. The car warmed up quickly just riding around the block 5 times. When before I did what you suggested i did forget to mention it when took it out on the freeway trying to pass the car my car was sitting at temp of 240. Now when I had the air filter out for that time you suggested it did run better going left up a hill and back.put the filter back in and it struggled. As for rough idle Not really i mean you can feel the sputtering when you are in park but the needle doesn't really move at all. As for when I start the car yes takes a couple seconds to kick over but that was there since i bought the car over two years ago thought it was normal. But a major definite loss of power..Right back to before hubby changed the fuel filter.But the service engine light isn't on anymore.;) oh yea and I have 82782 miles on my car now..WOW.

Relying on my man Rick
Dawniepoo

[1990hemigale]

So what code is stored?

[Dawniepoo]

ok so the code is po404, The guy that coded my car called back and said it narrowed it down to the EGR valve and will cost 125.00 for the part. My husband was like 125 for a EGR valve?? Then said....I hate your car lol. But there you go..Now does anyone have a $125 bucks i can borrow..lol. Thanks guys for your input. If you think you could add to this by all means go for it. Hubby is going to try and work on it this week. Let you know how it goes.


Dawniepoo

[KhellendrosXS]

eBay Grand am EGR valve for 9.99 so far:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/03-04Pontiac-grand-am-grand-AM-EGR-Valve-eng-3-4_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33557QQihZ014QQitemZ3 30202160282QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

[Dawniepoo]

good find there? And since I'm out of the ghetto state now and in Cali one day shipping..Thanks much!

Dawniepoo

[Dawniepoo]

Ahh ok.So were going to go to a local shop and get the part instead but stand by for update and cross you guyz fingers that it's right.I hope so..I'm starting to get tired of walking every morning and night to work.haha
Have a good night you guyz.

Dawniepoo

[KhellendrosXS]

Good luck. The EGR is really easy to change. I was just fooling with my UIM last week and I think there are only 3 bolts to undo.

[rixGAphx]

Ahh ok.So were going to go to a local shop and get the part instead but stand by for update and cross you guyz fingers that it's right.I hope so..I'm starting to get tired of walking every morning and night to work.haha
Have a good night you guyz.
DawniepooNNNNOOOOOOOEEEES!!!!

Your emissions system is GUARANTEED by GM and EPA and Al Gore to be clean and pass all emissions for 10 yrs/100k miles!!!
That includes the EGR valve!!!
When it fails, then the engine can't adequately control NOx, oxides of nitrogen, which cause ozone in the lower atmosphere.
edit: My point being, if the EGR valve HAS failed, GM should pickup the tab, by you going to a GM dealer.

The cat cleans the exhaust of CO and HC's and NOx, but the cat's efficiency is only monitored for CO and HC's, not for NOx.

And that e-bayer isn't going to let that EGR go for the initial low bid of $9.99; even used it's worth $75+.

P0404 = Exhaust Gas Recirculation Circuit Range/Performance.
This does NOT mean there's anything wrong with the EGR valve, even though that's the main EGR component.
It merely means there's a problem with the EGR CIRCUIT; the engine is automatically putting itself in a safe, rich mode that reduces NOx production and prevents valve damage.
* It has a little valve inside it that is electrically-operated, by 2 of the wires that plug into it. The valve can get dirty and stick; cleaning with WD-40 *may* unstick it.
* It has little 1/2" passages that lead to and from the valve, and they can clog with soot; clean with WD-40 and pipe cleaners.
* The electrical connector, or the wires to it, could be damaged or dirty; unplug/replug several times to kinda clean the pins and sockets.

A shop is gonna want to use a $350 NAPA guaranteed EGR valve, not the $125 you can get from Checker.
* * *

Are you saying that, when you drove around with the air filter box open, the car seemed to run:
* Much better? Then replace the air filter, it's still dirty.
* A little better, but nothing to write home about? Then the air fliter is prolly still OK.

Hope this helps,
-Rick

[Dawniepoo]

Ok so I put it in the dishwasher to get it clean since i didn't have pipe cleaner and didn't want to get dirty...:roll2: hahaha j/k anyway my husband did clean the best he could with pipe cleaner and WD-40 cleaned it real good yes it was very much corroded in there, but unfortunately it didn't work..The gaskets that were there were completely worn down to where there was nothing left of it. My husband did go and order the new one the original is not made anymore according to Kraggens*only auto shop I live near* so he ordered the next in line one. The part number is EGR valve-BWD EGR 1291. Cost was total 142.22 But gonna try to get GM to pay me back I am going to give them the receipt once I get it fixed.
Thanks again guys.Keep on stand by and let you know on Wednesday *when the part will/should be in* and hubby can replace it.

[Dawniepoo]

oh ya forgot to give you info rick,
k yes when I drove the car withOUT the air filter it drove a lil better not 100 or even 50% but nothing to write home about. I have a K&N air filter in there and had dumped out all the junk that was in it recently actually when you mentioned taking off the element. But still looks good..so can't imagine it being my air filter. And the gasket on it is still good as well. Ok bedy time..talk to ya'll soon.
Nite

[BattousaiX23]

if that don't work have the catalytic converter checked, because my dad had a 01 chevy impala the catalytic converter went bad and the car had the same response as your car, it was sluggish and it had a hard time getting up to speed.

[Dawniepoo]

Well that didn't work! SOB! Changed out the EGR valve took it out to freeway and the car didn't want to go basically still the same ..Hubby is thinking for now just gutting out the catalytic converter and just straight pipe it for now. lol. I found a flowmaster catalytic converter for 69.78 at race pages.com http://www.racepages.com/products/?Ne=28&N=1697+11519+4294967265+9189
with this do i have to do any modifications to make it fit.Hubby would like to know. Pretty soon gonna have all knew parts by the time i find the problem.lol. Besides what we've done to it so far..new egr valve new fuel filter and possible catalytic converter what else could do this? I refuse to take it to a shop..Pretty cool though learning lots about my car as I watch hubby work on it. Come to realize it is a B-e-O-tch to work on.lol why make it so impossible..Oh hmm do you think resetting the ECU would help since we replaced those parts already? And if so ummmm how do i do it and if it has to do with the battery to reset it how do I disconnect the battery?

thanks again

[Dawniepoo]

Oh one more thing..If I did straight pipe it would my sensor go nuts would it mess it up at all? Please read above as well on last thing I wrote.Every lil bit of info helps.

whats up fellas, this is dawniepoo's husband..First off just wanted to thank everyone for the help...So far ive replaced the fuel filter and the EGR valve. I took it out to see what it was doing and to see if I trusted it enough to drive it to the hobby shop at work so I could put it on a lift 45 min away...this is what the symptoms are......on the road below 20..drives fine..cant punch the gas though or it feels like its surges..almost like its not getting any fuel or clogged then all of a sudden drives completely normal..The EGR helped a little..at least its not doing it all the time now. On the HWY with normal driving it had a hard time getting past 3 grand and held @ 3grand and at 45MPH steady like it was governed. I had to ease up on the gas and feather foot it to get it to shift and yes...I was the convoy leader on the Hwy lol. once it finally up shifted it drove pretty good and didnt have any problems with it as long as I applied really really light pressure on the gas 1 to 2 miles to get up to 60mph rolling onto the hwy at around 20-30mph. I then took it up a hill on the way home..It had trouble getting up even when I dropped to 2nd pos it held at 20mph steady then all of a sudden drove normal and took off...kinda jerked me. All her plugs have spark so now im thinking fuel pump since the fuel filters already done and its has not thrown a check engine light since we have done what Rick said with the air filter as far as check engine light . The Cat on this car would throw a check light if it was faulty right? Not to sure what a faulty Catalytic converter would feel like driving because Ive always upgraded my exhaust systems on every vehicle ive owned to high flow or no cat at all and by passed the censor. Also is there a way to reset the ECU on this car? Anyways all hope the description of the symptoms above help out with trying to nail this problem..if you can solve this I would love to hear your response..thanks in advance....

hubbypoo..lol

[Dawniepoo]

Finally! And Yes you boyz were right it was that darn catalytic converter.I ended up only paying $180 out of pocket..well mine only haha mommy in law paid 300 of it.But all together between diagnostic, labor, and part was $481.00 He put an after market part in there instead of using the GM's stupid part.And Now!My boy runz awesome! I have a feeling though that there was a problem with that from the time that I bought the car cause it runs so much quicker now and I get when I turned the ignig a va-rooooom lol..Hey it sounds good to me..lol anyway alwayz trust you guyz rank ya!

Your girly wirly

[BattousaiX23]

glad to see that you got the problem solved.

[KC Kirk]

A perfect description of my problem, loss of power, feathering the gas to urge the speed slowly up, codes P0300 and P0404.

Result:

New fuel filter (Wix) cured codes P0300 and P0404
New Catalytic Converter (Flowmaster) cured the power loss.

Now the car runs great. 2002 Grand Am GT, 195,930 miles. I purchased the car a year ago with about 168,000 miles on it (mostly highway), and I think the catalytic converter was the original.

This forum is great.

[Dawniepoo]

yep and bout to buy and have installed a new muffler to even out the air flow. But at the same time going to change out the headers..this is going to be fun! hahaha.I want more power lol.:lol: