View Full Version : Engine issues
Atlas98
02-04-2008, 05:33 PM
K, so everything with my engine has been good with the exception that it's been suckin down oil like an drunkard in a bar. I'll include some pictures incase some one else has had this problem or knows what it is or may be.
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg196/Atlas988/DSCF0004.jpg
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg196/Atlas988/DSCF0003.jpg
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg196/Atlas988/DSCF0002.jpg
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg196/Atlas988/DSCF0001.jpg
Silversmok3
02-04-2008, 05:38 PM
Hmm.
The pics are useful, but more detail is necessary.No one here (that I know of) can look at an engine pic via an X-ray browser and see what the problem is.
For starters:
How much oil?
What sound is the engine making? ( any suspicious engine rattle,valve noise,etc?)
and what kind of maintenance has been done?
It could be an O-ring leak(Bad) ,or a loose oil drain plug(Good).
More details are needed.
Rivkid
02-04-2008, 06:04 PM
I'd take the coil off and check the valve cover gaskets. Most likely the easiest and cheapest(?) fix. And usually, a common one.
Be careful if you do pull the coil(aluminum plate that says 2.4L twin cam) as there is a braided ground wire attached to it-rather to the module(under the plate) itself.
rixGAphx
02-04-2008, 06:27 PM
Though they act like valve covers, those are actually cam covers.
And though they have gaskets that leak (just like valve cover gaskets) and it *appears* that might be your problem, R&R of cam covers is slightly more complex and requires more precision (during reinstallation) than valve covers.
You must be very careful about the tightening order and torque on the bolts.
Definitely buy a Haynes manual to help during this procedure (and the following one).
Also, the cam covers don't bolt directly onto the cylinderhead as valve covers do on 'conventional' OHV cam-in-block engines like the V6.
Rather, there is about a 3" thick hunk of aluminum known as the 'camshaft carrier' that sets on a gasket; which in turn sets atop the actual cylnderhead.
This cam carrier gasket also can leak.
The cam carrier R&R requires disconnection of the timing chain and camshaft drive gears, so it's an additional complex operation.
Make sure you know what's leaking before you dive in.
Completely wash the outside of the engine, using spray-can engine cleaner and the high-pressure wand at the coin carwash to get it as 'show-car clean' as possible.
Then add some Universal UV Dye (about $5 for a little bottle at Checker/AutoZone/etc.) to the oil, and drive a few days.
Then shine a 'Blacklight' at the engine in a darkened grage, and the leak locations glow.
Hope this helps,
-Rick
PS: We really could use some pics farther down the block, front and rear, to help determine if the cam cover or cam carrier gaskets are leaking.
Your leak could be something else altogether, like the oil pressure sensor.
Or it might not be a leak, it might be 'oil consumption' caused by old, worn piston rings or leaky valve seals.
It would help to know, how many quarts of oil you use per 1,000 miles, or similar 'usage' as silversmoke says.
Atlas98
02-04-2008, 08:47 PM
I meant to include this little fact when I orgionally posted but I guess it slipped my mind. However, earlier today I just added the second quart of oil in 1000-1500 miles, since the last oil change.
rixGAphx
02-05-2008, 11:54 AM
'01 4-cyl, 7-yrs old, about 85k miles??
1 quart per 1000 miles would be about the limit for 'accptable consumption' in an old engine.
2 quarts per 1500 miles = 1.33 quarts per 1000 miles.
This *could* be bad consumption and not a leak; but that would require:
* Very high milage to have worn the rings so much (150k++); or,
* A broken pair of compression rings on one cylinder or a hole in a piston; or,
* Worn/cracked/leaking valve seals.
Worn Rings:
High milage is high milage and causes piston rings and cylinder walls to wear, and a *little* oil escaping past the worn rings *might* not be visible in the exhaust, especially if every cylinder is burning the bypassed oil.
Your crankcase oil will get dirty VERY quickly after an oil change, because of the exhaust gases that push past those same worn rings.
Your cylinder compression will be very low in each cylinder, but will prolly be equally low in all cylinders.
Your plug tips will have carbon deposits.
Broken Rings/Piston:
Each piston has an Oil Control Ring, not to control the oil past it, but to distribute oil evenly around the cylinder bore for piston lubrication.
It is the 2 compression rings on each piston that seal exhaust gases above, and scrape the walls clean of oil.
Oil control rings rarely break, and don't affect oil consumption if they do.
It's often no big deal if one compression ring breaks, barely noticable in performance or oil usage.
It's very unusual for both compression rings on one piston to break; if they do, then there's a direct path of exhaust gas down into the crankcase, and of oil into the combustion chamber.
there might not even be enough compression for cylinder ignition, and misfires would be common.
That one oil-leaking cylinder will be producing a smoke-screen of unburned oil worthy of a James Bond movie.
And it's compression test would be significantly lower than the other 3.
That cylinder's plug tip will have carbon deposits.
Similar effects would result from a broken piston.
Valve Seals:
GM has gotten much better than the seals they used in mid-'70's 350 V8's which were guaranteed to harden/crack and leak at about 75k miles.
Still, leaking valve seals do happen.
They allow a tiny bit of oil to dribble down the valve stem, thru the tight space of the valve guides, and into the valve runners.
When the engine is running, the oil just flows and burns and is unnoticable.
After the engine is stopped, the dribbling continues for several minutes.
When the engine is then re-started, there is a drop or two on each valve. The drop on the intake valve is sucked-in and burned, and the drop on each exhaust valve is warmed and blown-out the exhaust.
The net result is a light blue fog out the exhaust pipe for the first 5-10 seconds after a cold engine is started; often mistaken for the water vapor that's common on cold mornings, but this oil vapor is visible even on a 110*F Phoenix summer afternoon.
So, those are your choices:
* Oil leaks on the outside of the engine yet to be found; or,
* Leaks from the oil passages into the coolant system (very easy to see, as there would be oil drops/globs floating in the coolant reservoir); or,
* Excessive oil consumption because of wear or other component failure.
We need to know your milage.
Your 1.33 quarts/1000 miles is right at the consumption of a well-cared for but tired engine at 150K++ miles.
Hope this helps,
-Rick
Atlas98
02-05-2008, 09:39 PM
Well, thats alot more in depth of a responce then I expected to but I'm not complaining. My milage is almost exactly 83k miles. As for care, I have been caring for it well, but seeing as I bought it at 60k miles I cannot vouch for how the previous owner maintained it.
However, this is the assumed milage, I recently found out that my car's engine had been replaced with a salvage engine. I don't know why it was replaced or the mileage of the engine it was replaced with :(
ENGGUY
02-06-2008, 10:41 PM
It looks like it is leaking around the bolt, maybe it is loose. Take the ignition cover off and give us more pictures. Don't try to remove the cam/valve covers. You have to take the whole front end of the engine (timing chain cover etc) apart first.
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