Could the head gasket be bad? Or is this normal

[Nickleahy23]

Well my gf's grand am is just having all kinds of problems like normal. The gas milage is horrible. It has the 4 banger in it. 97 GA GT...Now the oil level is 2 inches higher then the full mark on the dip stick, but it may be touching the sides of the tube and getting it on there. im not sure. Also when i take the cap off the oil fill, its like a cylinder..air blowing out like a 2 stroke motor in there. Is that just normal from crankcase pressure or could this be the head gasket/cracked head? Ive just never seen a vehicle blow air in and out of the oil fill hole when the cap is off, even if its running. Thanks as always.

[gt00]

Now the oil level is 2 inches higher then the full mark on the dip stick, but it may be touching the sides of the tube and getting it on there. im not sure. Also when i take the cap off the oil fill, its like a cylinder..air blowing out like a 2 stroke motor in there.Sounds like some issues here for sure , i'd do a compression test and a coolant system pressure test and see what turns up . But from what you say it could be a bad head gasket .... :(

[rixGAphx]

'97 4-cyl; 11-yrs old, about 130k miles?
It is nOT the 2.2 engine noted in your profile; the '97 4-cyl was the 2.4 liter.

Probably not a headgasket problem.
When headgaskets fail, then exhaust gases go either into the water jackets or directly out to the atmosphere. There is only one tiny littl path available for contamination of the crankcase (at the forward end of the block), and that's not where headgaskets fail.

Rather, you have 2 problems:
1. Somebody doesn't know know how to measure depth of oil.
Either it's overfilled, and 2 inches is a MAJOR over-fill problem, or it's not.
Dipsticks can be tricky to read, but we can't help you over the web.
Figure it out and fill it to the proper level.

2. The crankcase ventilation system is blocked.
This happens often on this engine, since it is such a complex maze of tubes.
Notice there is no PCV valve.
On most other engines, the PCV valve relieves crankcase pressure (from blowby of the worn piston rings) just fine.
This old engine is producing greater-than-normal crankcase pressure simply because it is old and tired and the rings are worn.

Look under and around the intake manifold.
See all those hoses and formed plastic parts that don't seem to be part of the throttle/intake manifold assembly?
They are the crankcase breathing appartus (used on the GA 4-cyls in lieu of a PCV system), and one of them is prolly kinked or crudded-up inside, preventing relief of crankcase pressure (into the intake manifold) for combustion in the cylinders.

You need to inspect/clean/replace that network, so crankase air flows freely from the cam galleies, the timeing case, the crankcase, and through to the intake.

Hope this helps,
-Rick

[Matt95GT]

I bet the hoses to/from the PCV baffle (keystone shape, sticks out of block near oil filter) are kinked or clogged resulting in pressure building in the pan. This has happened to others in the past too...
http://www.gaownersclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=83541

[Nickleahy23]

That could very well be the problem guys..that is exactly how many miles it has and such...and I recheck the oil and it was within spec..I think because of that pressure in there or something it was just up in the dipstick tube so it was giving a false reading...The SES light was on a month ago and it was something with the emmisions system/vaccuum system so I will look it over and see if I can figure that out. Any pictures of the parts I should be checking for the pressure relief? Thanks a ton guys

[jonnythan]

Nick, when you check the oil, you should pull the dipstick, wipe it clean, shove it back in, pull it out, THEN read the level.

If you just pull it out and look at it, you won't get a correct reading if it's been on recently.

[Nickleahy23]

Nick, when you check the oil, you should pull the dipstick, wipe it clean, shove it back in, pull it out, THEN read the level.

If you just pull it out and look at it, you won't get a correct reading if it's been on recently.

Lol I did that...I just did it while it was running cuz it was pouring rain and I was in a hurry. When I checked it while off it was fine..

[jonnythan]

Ah. Yeah, don't check the oil level with the engine running. The engine should be off for a few minutes first.

Dunno about air pumping out of the cap, though. I'd kind of expect a little, but not a lot.

[Nickleahy23]

Alright I have a few more questions..When the SES light was on it said it was the EVAP system..Could this be that part on the front of the motor that the GA has instead of a PCV? Would this make the car surge? It surges really bad when your hardly giving it gas..Could also be the fuel filter? Or what else? This car is driving me crazy.Its also getting horrible gas milage..Im guessing there all related

[Matt95GT]

Alright I have a few more questions..When the SES light was on it said it was the EVAP system..Could this be that part on the front of the motor that the GA has instead of a PCV? Would this make the car surge? It surges really bad when your hardly giving it gas..Could also be the fuel filter? Or what else? This car is driving me crazy.Its also getting horrible gas milage..Im guessing there all related

The EVAP system consists of the purge solenoid (mounted to your AC compressor), charcoal canister (passenger side, under coolant tank) and associated lines. The lines could be either clogged or cracked open, or it could be as simple as a bad gas cap that doesn't seal.

I don't think it is possible to have any significant surging though... one of my EVAP lines was split wide open and it caused no drivability issues.

[rixGAphx]

OK, this is the first you've mentioned of the SES light being 'on'.
Please have the codes read again, for free at AutoZone/Checker/etc., and this time report back to us with all the exact P0xxx code numbers.

How many miles on the engine???

If 130k as would be about *normal* for an 11-yr old car, then when were the following replaced?
* Spark plugs.
* Catalytic converter.
* Front O2 sensor.

Is the engine ever hard to start (takes a lot of 'cranking' before it fires)?
Is the idle smooth, or does it also vary up-and-down?

Sorry for all the questions, but the answers will really help us determine what is nOT the problem, and thus help narrow the possiblities.

Standing by,
-Rick

[Nickleahy23]

The light was only on for 2 days and I got it checked at autozone but the lady couldnt tell me anything other then evap...it hasnt been on since... ya the car has 124,000 miles

The plugs were changed 2k ago and are still clean. no idea on the cat or the 02 sensor..cat looks original...

The car normally starts good, but my gf said it took extended cranking the other day. Also when you stop at a stop light, then proceed to take off, it doesnt want to go, then it just takes off. Idle is normally pretty smooth but once and a while it will go up and down for no apparent reason..

The oil was changed today and it was fine..dirty but fine. No signs of coolant in it so thats a good thing.

No problem on all the questions ill gladly answer anything to get this figured out.

If I can ill get it scanned again and see if that code is still in there.

Thanks for all of the help guys..If you ever need help with a fullsize chevy/gmc im here for the help lol..Just have no idea with these 4 bangers

[rixGAphx]

Replace that front O2 sensor. It was only intended to last 8-yrs/80k miles, and it is flat worn-out; it's still giving data to the PCM, but the way an O2 sensor deteriorates is that it takes longer and longer for it to perform its little chemical analysis and report the data.
The PCM absolutely depends on the front O2 sensor data for determining fuel injection.
Right now, that old one is costing you at least 20% in extra fuel, because it is giving data to the PCM too slowly. When the PCM gets data slowly, it defaults to a richer-running setting.
You will be f'n AMAZED at the difference in smoothness, power, response, and fuel savings.
It will pay for itself in less than 3 months at today's gas prices.

It may also clear that 'stumbling from a stop' condition, and the 'surging,' though personally I think those a result of a faulty Throttle Position Sensor.
But we can't determine that until the codes are checked and the O2 sensor is fully-functioning.

Hope this helps,
-Rick

[Nickleahy23]

thanks a bunch man...I was planning on replacing it but didnt know when I was going to..Ill do that next week and get back to you...Im hoping that will fix a bunch of the problems..Also are these 4 bangers known to have a loud timing chain/upper end? Its like you can almost hear the gears when its idling and such...

[GAJ83]

Also are these 4 bangers known to have a loud timing chain/upper end? Its like you can almost hear the gears when its idling and such...

I've heard a Cavalier with a bad timing chain, and it is quite noisy. My GA has nearly 198k and is as quiet as the day I bought it (thank God!). I think when you start hearing it chatter a lot, maybe it is time to think about a new chain/tensioners. I don't know exactly. Mine sounds consistent(clicks quietly). The bad one was really loud and not very consistent.

[Nickleahy23]

Well i bought a new pre cat O2 sensor today and ill throw it in tomorrow to see..and for the noise..Its very consistant, just louder then it should me..God I dont want to deal with a timing chain..