Intake Questions...Lots

[jbacker7]

Alright so I've been searchin and searchin but still have plenty of questions...

Whats the difference between a WAI and Short Ram?

Would a Cold Air Box be as good a mod as a regular CAI?

How hard would it be to make your own WAI or Short Ram?

Thanks

[mikekanzler]

http://www.gaownersclub.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=17260

this link may be a lot of help to you it gives a faq on cai hope it helps

[gt00]

Whats the difference between a WAI and Short Ram?

Would a Cold Air Box be as good a mod as a regular CAI?

How hard would it be to make your own WAI or Short Ram?

ThanksThey're basically the same thing . Cold air box is better than a WAI / Short Ram , but not as good as a CAI . You could make one , but it's far easier to just pick up a 'chrome intakes' or other quality CAI from e bay and slap it on .... ;)

[jbacker7]

But how cheap would it be just to get some pipe and make my own? Because money's tight....:(

[gt00]

But how cheap would it be just to get some pipe and make my own? Because money's tight....:(You could just get some 3" piping and fab one up . But you'd still need couplers and clamps and a good filter . And it still would be sucking warm air ... ;)

[jbacker7]

Haha yea, but on doctorspeeds website ...

http://www.doctorspeed.com/grand_am/grand-am-intakes.html

it says the short ram should give you 5-8 hp with the CAI being 8-10, now if I went and made my own short ram, extended it to where the factory airbox is, put in a piece of sheet metal, I would basically have a "cold air box" correct, which to me if the short ram gives you 5-8 the cold air box should give you more than that so could it be just as effecient as the CAI????

[gt00]

Sure you could effectively build a cold airbox , and it would work well . A CAI just takes cooler air from down in the fender well . I don't know if the stated HP numbers would be true in every application , note they say 'should give you' XX power .

[jbacker7]

Yea thats true, but any ideas on the price of building one of your own? It really doesn't sound that difficult.....think it would be?

[gt00]

Yea thats true, but any ideas on the price of building one of your own? It really doesn't sound that difficult.....think it would be?That would obviously depend on how handy you are at fabbing stuff up , and the cost of the parts . It would be the way to go if you have no money and want to learn .... :)

[jbacker7]

Sweeeet, now, all I would really have to do is get the pipes and everything, couple everything together and seal it with silicone and install it after I take the airbox out, correct?

[gt00]

Sweeeet, now, all I would really have to do is get the pipes and everything, couple everything together and seal it with silicone and install it after I take the airbox out, correct?Basically yeah , remember all the stock sensors etc. have to be plumbed in . Another thing to consider is it would be very simple to make a stage 1 intake like the one on the DS site . That way would be easier if your not too sure of the difficulty of making one yourself ... ;)

[jbacker7]

Ok, this is where I get confused, the Stage 1 and the Short Ram look about the same but the ram looks to be angled a little bit....How would it be different building either one? They both sit in the space where you take the airbox out of and could both be shielded off with a piece of sheet metal.

[gt00]

Ok, this is where I get confused, the Stage 1 and the Short Ram look about the same but the ram looks to be angled a little bit....How would it be different building either one? They both sit in the space where you take the airbox out of and could both be shielded off with a piece of sheet metal.The stage 1 uses the stock 'ribbed' tube with everything plumbed into it . The Short Ram replaces that tube with an aluminum piece with the proper holes built into it . The ribbed part is supposedly more restrictive , that's why it's removed in the more expensive intakes . But as you can see alot more work and parts would go into making it .... ;)

[jbacker7]

Haha ok, now, I'm not very experienced but to me it sounds like I'd only have to get my piping, couplers, and the rest you know. Connect the pipe and seal it, put on the filter, and just make sure I don't disrupt any wiring or sensors, is this right?

And BTW, as I'm obviously new to this :), what do you mean by plumbing?

[gt00]

For the stage 1 setup yes , otherwise you'll have to add the sensors to the piece you'd make to replace the ribbed pipe . By 'plumbing' i mean drilling the necessary holes / grommets for the IAT sensor and breather tube to enable them to be hooked up .

[jbacker7]

And to move a sensor you have to.......?

[gt00]

And to move a sensor you have to.......?Remove it from the stock ribbed piece and 'plumb' it into the new pipe you'd make . You can see now that making the stage 1 using the stock ribbed piece and just adding some pipe and coupler / clamps and filter would be easier . :P

[jbacker7]

OOOO hahaha now I get it, all the sensors are in the plastic ribbed part correct? Yes adding a length of pipe onto that and then a filter and "heat shield" would be a lot easier without moving the sensors. Think you'd still get the full effect of the "cold air box"?

[gt00]

OOOO hahaha now I get it, all the sensors are in the plastic ribbed part correct? Yes adding a length of pipe onto that and then a filter and "heat shield" would be a lot easier without moving the sensors. Think you'd still get the full effect of the "cold air box"?:D Yep . It would just not replace the ribbed pipe , and therefore be a 'little bit' more restrictive . But you'd still get cooler air and more power ... ;)

[jbacker7]

That's good, and if I ever get bored enough then I can replace the plastic tubing then ;) haha. Alright I know I need 3inch tubing and thats about all I know.......I'm new to this game so can ya help me out please? Thanks!

[gt00]

Alright so I've been searchin and searchin but still have plenty of questions...Your not kidding .... :lol:

[jbacker7]

Lol, I'm just glad someone who knows what they're talkin about is tellin me what to do! haha.......I love this website.

[jbacker7]

Anyway, now I'm asking............

What do I need to make myself a cold air box from the stock plastic tubing outward?

[jackpot]

have you guys ever seen this chrome intake for a grand am with a heat shield?

http://cgi.ebay.ca/CF-94-02-03-04-Grand-Am-Alero-Malibu-V6-Air-Intake-TB_W0QQitemZ370051682508QQihZ024QQcategoryZ38634QQ cmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1713.m153.l1262

think its a little restrictive compared to an open k&n?

im thinking about getting this pretty soon

http://cgi.ebay.ca/94-03-04-Grand-Am-Alero-Malibu-V6-Air-Intake-TB-K-N-FT_W0QQitemZ330236456025QQihZ014QQcategoryZ38634QQ cmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1713.m153.l1262

peace
JP

[jbacker7]

Alright I've been researching and researching this and here's what I think I'm gonna do....

I'm gonna leave the plastic pipe on with the sensors....
Attach a 3 inch piece of aluminum pipe onto that.....
A rubber (or plastic idk exactly what they're made out of) coupler with the 2 screw tightened belts you know.....
And then my cone filter...
Of course this will have the heat shield between the filter and the engine.

You guys think this will work?

[Blackhawk]

This is how mine is set up:
tb
silicone coupler with 2 hose clamps and sensor holes
pipe (leave bellowed tube or go to www.mpracing.org and buy the tube)
silicone coupler with 2 hose clamps
maf
heat shield
hose clamp holding filter onto maf lip
filter
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n134/sudden_impulse/DSCN0515.jpg

[jbacker7]

Ahhh, silicone. Ok, that makes sense. Your's are just painted red with the silver clamps correct? And what's the piece that looks like it bolts to something between your MAF and heat shield? Wait a minute.....that IS your MAF, correct?

[cardude007617]

mpracing ftw. end of thread

[jbacker7]

Nope, I'm not gonna spend $200 on something that I don't want in the first place. AND in Nebraska I'd suck up so much crap into a CAI, thats why I'm focusing on the Cold Air Box design.

[TA^Guy]

Ahhh, silicone. Ok, that makes sense. Your's are just painted red with the silver clamps correct? And what's the piece that looks like it bolts to something between your MAF and heat shield? Wait a minute.....that IS your MAF, correct?
If you have a brand name air filter and all you need is the aluminum tubing and couplers you could pick up a inexpensive CAI on Ebay and use whatever parts you need. No need to over pay for stuff, tubing is tubing. If you don't want to get it from ebay or another place online I think most parts stores sell sections of aluminum tubing now for custom intakes so you can purchase just the sections you need for what you are making.

mpracing ftw. end of thread
It might be the end of the thread if the thread's title was "How to waste your money on over priced modifications." :lol:

[jbacker7]

^^^Hahaha thats just what I was thinking.

Alright that's what I planned on doing. I think I understand it now. If I'm not going to replace the stock ribbed plastic tubing then all I really need to do is remove the stock airbox. And connect a cone filter to the lip on the MAF correct and if I wanted to I could put some tube between the MAF and the filter but would it have any benefit?

[TA^Guy]

No that would have slight improvement. The ribbed rubber stuff will make the air more turbulant than having a smooth tube. I'd replace the ribbed stuff for the few extra bucks that it would cost.

[gt00]

If I'm not going to replace the stock ribbed plastic tubing then all I really need to do is remove the stock airbox. And connect a cone filter to the lip on the MAF correct and if I wanted to I could put some tube between the MAF and the filter but would it have any benefit?In doing that you'd have a WAI , (sucking warm under hood air) By extending the filter you could do the cold airbox thing and gain more power . John is correct in that if you retain the ribbed tube you will have a more turbulent flow of air , but it would be easier i guess . I'd just break down and buy that piece if you don't think you could fab one up ..... ;)

[Blackhawk]

They could have extended my filter out a bit too but the sheild was designed to use some of the same mounting holes as my stock airbox IIRC, been a while since I installed it.
I would have recommended the tube with sensors predrilled from MP Racing but I can't find it anymore, either they removed it or I'm retarded, both are equally possible.

[TA^Guy]

The sensors for my truck I just drilled a hole into the coupler and pushed it into place.
Couldn't get any easier.

[jbacker7]

It doesn't sound too complicated to take a piece of pipe and cut holes in it for the sensors to fit into but how do they stay in?? And I'd have to couple it to the lip on the throttle body and the MAF right? Does it matter where the sensors are or not?

[FusionDreams]

I agree MPRacing may have some overpriced objects, but the CAI I got from them was about $35 cheaper than any other one I found...

And a word to the wise, especially if you're doing a full intake, the stock one is a PITA... If you're going to take it all apart, be ready to have a jack as there's a few parts that head below the battery and can only really be accessed by taking the front tire off...

EDIT: And if you'd like, maybe in a couple of days I can take some up close pictures of how my CAI works so you can get an idea how to make it yourself... That being with the wiring and how to "plumb" them in..

[jbacker7]

Yes I would like that very much :) Thank you

[FusionDreams]

Like I said, mine is a cold air intake, straight from MPRacing, so if you're going to go with a box, it'll be a bit different but I can try to get some pictures taken tomorrow as long as the weather holds up...

[jbacker7]

Sweet, thanks, all I really need to know is how to take the sensors out and hook them in. I mean drilling holes in a piece of pipe isn't that hard. And couplers are pretty self explanatory. But thanks alot I've been lookin since I've started this thread for some good pics to look at.

[TA^Guy]

It doesn't sound too complicated to take a piece of pipe and cut holes in it for the sensors to fit into but how do they stay in?? And I'd have to couple it to the lip on the throttle body and the MAF right? Does it matter where the sensors are or not?

If you drill holes into the actual pipe for the sensors buy rubber grommets to hold the sensors in. But I didn't drill holes in the pipes, I drilled holes into the rubber couplers so there are no need for grommets. Jus tmake sure you drill a hole slightly smaller than the diameter of the sensor so it holds it tight.

[jbacker7]

Alright thanks, but how do I remove and install the sensors? Do they just pull and pop or what? Thanks

[Blackhawk]

^Pretty much, while being careful at the same time. The breather is set up right at the coupler so that one's simple, and you can have the IAT wherever you want as long as the wire reaches.

[jbacker7]

The IAT would be the sensor that is on the side of the ribbed tube on the stock intake right? How hard do they pull cuz I dont wanna pull too hard and snap something?

[Blackhawk]

Yeah, it's the side one. You should just be able to get it out with barely any pressure. Pull the electrical clip first to get more room for your hand.

[jbacker7]

And the thing that goes in on the top of the tube?

[Blackhawk]

Pops out the same way. Just make sure you don't pull the other end out, it's a bitch to hook back in without removing stuff.

[jbacker7]

Alright but I can just pull them out and expect them not to break correct?

[Blackhawk]

As long as you don't yank it if it won't budge, yeah. If you have any problems just post pics and we can help you. Tomorrow if you have questions I may be able to look at Derek's (sudden_impulse) car, he's running stock still for now.

[jackpot]

hey guys

sorry if i should have made my own threats but considering this is titled intake question (lots!) lol i thought it would be ok

for this chrome intake on ebay

http://cgi.ebay.ca/94-03-04-Grand-Am-Alero-Malibu-V6-Air-Intake-TB-K-N-FT_W0QQitemZ230254283497QQihZ013QQcategoryZ38634QQ ssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

it should have the two pipes required to remove the ribbed tubing and attach the cone filter
I was wondering does this already have all the holes predrilled to fit the sensors completely or does it need to be fabed a bit?

I see your intake setup blackhawk is a little different than this one, you have the MAF right up against the cone filter, this one seems to have the MAF in the middle between two pipes

anyway if you guys could let me know about it that would be great, if its all ready to just basically slap together i think im gonna buy this pretty quick

want to get an intake going before i do the exhaust

also where did you get that heatshield from blackhawk, prob wouldnt be too hard to cut one or something but you said it had places to use the stock screw holes, do you know where i could get one from?

peace
JP

[Blackhawk]

I got it from Dr Speed as the Cold Air Box back in the day when it was a reliable company.

[jackpot]

ah damn, had always wanted that, seems a nice an easy setup

emailed him a bunch, never got any replies, no chance i was gonna buy it with him not replying.

so do you guys know if those chrome intakes are ready to install, predrilled etc.

any other ideas for a heat shield, how to fab, buy etc

peace
JP

[Blackhawk]

Get a sheet of aluminum, bend tabs in the bottom to mount, cut the top and sides to fit. Spray black or color of choice.

[lester107]

also sorry to thread jack but this sorta goes along with what he is asking. Does anyone know how much pipe is needed and the angels of the bend in it to make a cold air intake?

[Blackhawk]

Depends on the filter. Grab a coathanger, unbend it, and bend it to the inside of the shape you want for your setup. The ideal way would be about 1.5" from the edges. Cut the excess, find out what legs are on the angles you want, and there ya go. I think a CAI takes a 90* and a 45* or 30*, depending on the size of the filter and the placement you want.

[jbacker7]

Alright so I'm gonna try to go pick up my stuff tomorrow...one last question. The only sensors are the IAT and the MAF, correct? Theres no sensor that goes into the airbox right?

[gt00]

Theres no sensor that goes into the airbox right?Not on a 99+ .... ;)

[jbacker7]

Alright sweet, this should be pretty easy. Knock on wood. ;)