My sorrows to magus

[graden]

Dude thats roughf man... sorry to hear about that.

[GrandAmageGT]

Agreed. My condolences to you and your entire family.

[Jibo]

I agree, my condolences to you and yours, this is a truly tragic situation.

[Colin]

Sorry to hear about your Cousin , my heart go's out to the family and yourself . Thanks for posting the warning about working under cars with only a jack , maybe others can learn how dangerous this truly is .

[sunrunner_pei]

I am deeply sorry to head of your loss, Don. To help to prevent this from ever happening again, I've added your story to the front page of the GAOC. Hopefully others will heed the warnings.

Shawn

[JoeyK]

That's very sad, I'm so sorry to hear of your loss. Reminds me of a time I went to work w/ my dad for a day when I was a teen. On the way there we saw a guy under his car & appeared to be working on it. when we came home some 9 hours later he was still under the car, in the same postion, it struck us as odd so we turned around to check on him. Sure enough, the poor guy was dead, the car had fallen on him sometime in the morning & suffocated him. Had he used jackstands he'd probably be atround today. I also have another very important rule: I don't get under a vehicle, no matter how well supported unless there's someone around to help incase something should go wrong. Because that poor guy would have lived had someone been around to get a jack under that in time & lift it off of him. He suffocated because his neck was pinched between the tire & the wheel well. I don't wanna go into grose details, but let's just say there were signs that he tried to free himself.
So take heed: Support it correctly & keep someone around incase of an emergency. It can happen to you!

[LoneRangers15]

Sorry for your loss. I have a question, though. Where is the best place to jack up a car and use jackstands? On the front I jack it up by the bumper and place the jackstands under the front suspension supports (the pieces that connect the suspension to the body). In the back I use the rear axle. Is this the correct way?

[JoeyK]

I wouldn't jack it up by the bumper. all that is is high impact plastic underneath! I jack mine up by the front subframe/ engine cross member & the rear by the axle. that's also where I put my jack stands.

[Night Wolf]

I am very sorry to hear about that, I can imagine how it must be....

....One other note about these jacks..... NEVER use the jack supplied with the car Z(for the spare tire) to rely on it soley to keep the car up while under it.... they were not designed to hold the car for extended periods of time, only to take a bad tire off and put a new one on..... don't use them for anything besides that.

[MagusXIII]

I personally want to thank all of you for your condolences. It IS tough becuase...we emailed each other just 2 hrs prior. :( It is one thing to see a loved one go after suffering, but for something this sudden? I was very close to my cousin growing up.

I feel this is very important to get out because obviously, this was a nice style Craftsman floor jack. This was not the OEM jack nor a 10 dollar special. It can be the expensive jacks used in NASCAR but that still did not save my cousin's life. I know I am a bit passionate about things and will voice my opinion no matter what. Well, this is something I feel very strongly about. I knoew my cousin used a jack but sadly I never knew it was the jack only. Even still, I just CANNOT believe he is gone... I owe a lot to him as when I was a PC newbie, he helped me out with everything!

Once again, I thank all of you for your thoughts. It IS deeply appreciated.


Don

[LoneRangers15]

Originally posted by JoeyK
I wouldn't jack it up by the bumper. all that is is high impact plastic underneath! I jack mine up by the front subframe/ engine cross member & the rear by the axle. that's also where I put my jack stands.
Not the plastic, the piece of metal under the radiator in front of the air dam. I just thought it was the bumper.

[VanishingImage]

I'm sorry to hear bout that man,my condolences go out to you and your cousin's family...I was changing the oil in my car and i had the car up on its side with the jack a couple cement blocks and looked around and saw how nasty the splash gaurd under neath the front bumper,it is VERY dangerous to be under a car no matter what...Sorry again man.

[MagusXIII]

Originally posted by JoeyK
I don't wanna go into grose details, but let's just say there were signs that he tried to free himself.
So take heed: Support it correctly & keep someone around incase of an emergency. It can happen to you!
No, you go right ahead and post the full gory details! If it prevents what happened to my family from happening to any others, then it is well worth the gory details.


Don

[jayhawk]

My deepest sympathy, Don. I nearly died from the same thing.

When I had my 1986 Parisenne, I jacked it up to change the oil WITHOUT the stands. Well guess what. I am only here today because my head was turned side ways and mind you, the frame, THE FRAME smacked the side of my head. I got away with a throbbing headache. If my head was horizontal to the pavement, it would have cracked open.

Don, this accident your cousin, your family, your friend suffered was terrible. Thank goodness he passed on quickly. Really.

[JoeyK]

Well, sadly, the poor guy tore his hands & fingers to shreds trying to free himslef. There were bloody fingerprints all over under the car & around the wheel well opening. The Paramedics said he had that he had that supprised "deer in the headlights" look on his face when they freed his lifeless body. They remarked that it must have been torture for him to fight for his life untill he suffocated, knowing no one was going to come to his rescue.
I wasn't near the car when they freed him, but it's still something I will never forget & I learned from that experience - I am really extra cautious when I'm under a car. Like I said, I block the hell out of it & I won't go under unless there's someone else around just incase.

[Night Wolf]

About that feeling about being under the car.... I know when I was changeing the oil on my Caddy, I had the car on the 2 heavy steel ramps (each pair can hold almost 7000lbs... so it was fine) I had the e-brake on full and the tranny in park, so I knew the car wasn't going anywhere.... but laying on my back, looking up at the car, knowing that if it was to come down, my face would get smashed by the engine brace or oil pan, but not before the curb guard thingy cut though my gut..... it was just a strange feeling, my first real time ebing under a car by myself. But my setup was alot safer, and almost (gotta say almost, becase you never know) fail-proof..... but using a hydrolic jack, as the only thing holding the car up....well...... not for me.

[gagt98driver]

One other thing that wasn't mentioned, always check the jack's ability to hold a load before getting too involved (i.e. under the car, taking the wheel off etc.) with the repairs/maintenance.

I jacked up my fiancee's car last year to take a tire off that had gotten a nail in it. Took the tire off and ran over to the tire shop to get it fixed. Came back about 2 hours later (did some shopping while out). The jack had dropped about 3 inches or more (I couldn't get the tire back on) and I had to pump the handle a few times to get it back up. The jack had a leaky hydraulics that I wasn't aware of (not leaking out, but leaking internally). Needless to say, that jack went in the dumpster and I bought a new one.

About jack stands. I don't really trust them or ramps either. Too much of a chance of jackstands tipping over and too much of a chance of a weak point in the welds on the ramps letting loose.

Whenever I have to get a car up off the ground to get under neath it to do work, I always use cinder blocks topped with a piece of of plywood and a 2x6 on top of that to spread out the weight and give a much wider and more stable base to lessen the likelyhood of the car slipping off the supports. Concrete cinderblocks and wood have tremendous compression strenght. I also always leave the jack under the car, not supporting it but just resting against the frame member as a safety measure to catch the car should the cinder blocks and wood give out.

[MagusXIII]

Originally posted by gagt98driver
One other thing that wasn't mentioned, always check the jack's ability to hold a load before getting too involved (i.e. under the car, taking the wheel off etc.) with the repairs/maintenance.

I jacked up my fiancee's car last year to take a tire off that had gotten a nail in it. Took the tire off and ran over to the tire shop to get it fixed. Came back about 2 hours later (did some shopping while out). The jack had dropped about 3 inches or more (I couldn't get the tire back on) and I had to pump the handle a few times to get it back up. The jack had a leaky hydraulics that I wasn't aware of (not leaking out, but leaking internally). Needless to say, that jack went in the dumpster and I bought a new one.

Very good point, Scott. I suspect that may have been the issue with my cousin's jack. It was slowly losing the ability to hold the hydraulics. But sadly, it reached a pt where it gave way suddenly.

About jack stands. I don't really trust them or ramps either. Too much of a chance of jackstands tipping over and too much of a chance of a weak point in the welds on the ramps letting loose.
FWIW, the ramps I use are Tru-Cut Ultra Ramps (http://www.ultraramps.com). They are of a one piece stamping so there are no welds to break. The Ultra Ramps plus do have a secondary brace welded under the ramp, but the ramp itself is still one piece. Those are the ones I would strongly recommend. They never flexed even under the weight of a 1977 Toronado.


Whenever I have to get a car up off the ground to get under neath it to do work, I always use cinder blocks topped with a piece of of plywood and a 2x6 on top of that to spread out the weight and give a much wider and more stable base to lessen the likelyhood of the car slipping off the supports. Concrete cinderblocks and wood have tremendous compression strenght. I also always leave the jack under the car, not supporting it but just resting against the frame member as a safety measure to catch the car should the cinder blocks and wood give out.
Agreed. And when using cinder blocks that have cavities in them, make sure the cavities are vertical when you are setting the car on them.


Don

[1996v6corsica]

i dont use cinder blocks... i use ramps and i block the back tires and turn on the e-brake... i used to use cinder blocks but when i dropped one on the grass from like three feet up and it broke... i dont trust them anymore

[Night Wolf]

i used to use cinder blocks but when i dropped one on the grass from like three feet up and it broke... i dont trust them anymore

Well, the cinder is not made to be dropped, that is not where it has it's strength. It is made to compress (or lack of) as it can hold a tremoundous amount of weight before it starts to crack.

Just like if you have a wall of cinderblocks, like the side of a garage or something, it has realitivly no strength side to side, like if you were to drive a car though it, or try and put a anchor in the wall to hold something back..... the wall will just sollaspe, but it can support alot of weight pushing down (wall, roof and alot of snow on room as example)

My ramps are solid, then there is a brace that goes from the front to back that is held in by bolts.... I trust them.